The new Circuit game mode invalidates Warframe parts grind, and I'm torn

[inappropriatename5877]

So as far as I have understood, the new Circuit mode enables players to do missions in sequence and get rewards. Among those rewards are warframe parts and blueprints, including frames whose parts or main blueprints are acquired only through their respective quests. While on the one hand I'm glad that new players won't have to endure the grind for parts, I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination missions, spy missions, or defection (yuk) missions trying to get all the parts for the warframe they wanted. And it's not like Warframes have MR requirements. The only "requirement" relies on a certain planet being accessible, so you can farm the frame in that planet, but the whole thing is now bypassed with the Circuit mode, and the only limit would be the materials required for building the frames, as they can be exclusive to a planet.

Now maybe I have understood the Circuit mode wrong, and it only enables you to get those warframes if you have already farmed them once or something. But if that is not the case, then what about the frames that are obtainable through quests? Will the quest count as completed once you have made the frame or something?

So in summary, while I have always been a proponent of less grind and more substance, and DE is certainly trying to lessen it, I feel kinda bad that I (and the majority of the playerbase) had to spend so much time grinding, while new players will save a ton of time.

[Pizzarugi]

Eh. Grinding for certain quest frames felt like an absolute chore. Nidus and Mesa comes to mind. If Circuit lets you circumvent it, I say all the power to players who go that route.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

"I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination..."

A game is allowed to make things easier or give alternate options for new people to grind. 

Does a rich person buying a bunch of plat also spit in your face? Yes or no? 

Also, new players still have to:

1. Max focus

2. Get full rank arcanes

3. Actually learn mechanics and hone reflexes.

4. Get plenty of other frames and weapons besides the few starter frames you're upset about them having, essentially making you a gate keeper.

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

It's a good thing, just because we suffered with some of the grinds it doesn't mean everyone should suffer too.

[inappropriatename5877]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

"I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination..."

A game is allowed to make things easier or give alternate options for new people to grind. 

Does a rich person buying a bunch of plat also spit in your face? Yes or no? 

Also, new players still have to:

1. Max focus

2. Get full rank arcanes

3. Actually learn mechanics and hone reflexes.

4. Get plenty of other frames and weapons besides the few starter frames you're upset about them having, essentially making you a gate keeper.

1) You are mentioning things (focus, arcane, mechanics) I never once said I was irked about

2) It's not a "few starter frames". According to the wiki, there is a rotation of a total of 33 frames, which is more than half of the total frames that are currently in the game

3) I have to reiterate that I AM glad that new players don't get to endure the grind we had to endure. Being "torn" though is not about gatekeeping, but about expressing conflicting emotions about an event. I do not aim to gatekeep, but I still feel like the hours I poured into the game to farm the frames just went up in flames, in a sense.

The post is more like a mini vent of sorts

[Tsukinoki]

32 minutes ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

while new players will save a ton of time.

How so?

They get one frame per week.  That's it.
Just one frame.

And to get that one frame they need to grind to rank 10 in the circuit (which for a new player won't be fast or easy)

SO the process to get a frame from the circuit is:
-Wait for the frame to appear in the circuit (once every 18 weeks or so)
-THEN grind to rank 10 in the circuit
-THEN they need to farm the resources to build that frame.
-THEN they need to wait the 4 days needed for that frame to build.

And if for some reason they don't make it to rank 10?  Oh well, they either need to wait for the frame to re-appear in the rotation (and with 53 frames and 3 choices per week works out to 18 weeks before the frame pops up again) OR grind it out the long way to get the parts that they didn't make it to in the circuit grind.

Meanwhile for the vast majority (not all but majority) of the farm-able frames I can get them far faster than that if I have half a mind to do so....I can sure as hell get more than one of the harder to grind frames per week since I know what to do and how to do it efficiently.

 

All in all they don't save that much time.
Sure, for some frames like Ash or Oberon it might be "easier" to grind through 10 rounds in the circuit than to do the railjack...but again that takes 18 weeks between appearances...meanwhile it takes less than 18 weeks to get the ability to use railjack and just farm those frames on your own terms.  And once you have access to railjack it takes far less time to grind out one of those frames than it does getting the circuit to rank 10.

[Merrcenary]

most of all, this devalues the bosses that dropped the blueprints so now DE can just ignore them and not even rework or add new ones since there is no need for them anymore

[(XBOX)Cram Duahcim]

40 minutes ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

"I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination..."

A game is allowed to make things easier or give alternate options for new people to grind. 

Does a rich person buying a bunch of plat also spit in your face? Yes or no? 

Also, new players still have to:

1. Max focus

2. Get full rank arcanes

3. Actually learn mechanics and hone reflexes.

4. Get plenty of other frames and weapons besides the few starter frames you're upset about them having, essentially making you a gate keeper.

And clear the star-chart for Steel Path access.

Not to mention farm 2 warframs if they want to engage with Helminth. Having other ways/opportunities to farm for Warframes help everyone. 

The other paths are still open if you want to target a warframe. So having more options is always a good thing.

[(XBOX)Cram Duahcim]

11 minutes ago, Merrcenary said:

most of all, this devalues the bosses that dropped the blueprints so now DE can just ignore them and not even rework or add new ones since there is no need for them anymore

Not really, it's a weekly rotation for a chance at ONE warframe. 

You still need 2 if you want to engage with Helminth. So farming a second set from the bosses isn't irrelevant. Now you could wait for that specific frame to reappear if you want, but that could be a long wait considering you've got 53+ warframes in the same rotation pool.

[-SilverWolfPrime-]

I'm just gonna throw my two cents in here. I'm questioning the opportunity to be able to get quest Warframes like Nidus, Revenant, etc., but I'm just gonna say I would never, ever, ever wish upon another player the long grind it took me to get base Trinity twice.

Screw the Ambulas boss fight.

[(PSN)Unstar]

17 minutes ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

While on the one hand I'm glad that new players won't have to endure the grind for parts, I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination missions, spy missions, or defection (yuk) missions trying to get all the parts for the warframe they wanted.

I get the impression that you want to be the kind of person who celebrates positive changes like this, and that in spite of that you're struggling with this other negative feeling.  I hope I can help with that.

Emotions like frustration and anger are often related to a simple question: "What about me?"  You see things getting better for others in ways that they can't get better for you, because you had already finished your journey down that road and successfully come out the other side.  You recognize that the game is better now, and you're happy for those who will have a better experience.  And yet there's still that question: "What about me?"  It's a reasonable question, so let's genuinely engage with it.

What could change this situation to make things better for you?  What could DE have done differently to create this new and improved system for their players that wouldn't feel upsetting to you?  I'm guessing you don't want them to not improve the system, though that is one solution that keeps the playing field level.  They can't give you the time you spent farming back.  I suppose they could give you some resources, or a booster, or some manner of achievement showing that you did the thing before the thing got easier.  Or even just a verbal acknowledgment or an apology that years ago when you earned the frame, you didn't have the opportunity to do it in this new-and-improved way.  I can't say if any of this would meaningfully address your situation, but maybe it would?

Though what I can say is that such solutions seem unsustainable for DE.  With every patch and update, DE is making improvements to the game.  They are solving bugs that inconvenienced or blocked players, they are streamlining systems that were previously clunky and restrictive, they are adding new ways of farming already-existing resources, they are re-balancing the game in ways that often make it easier and more accessible, and they are improving the new player experience, funneling players increasingly towards recent content.  Every major patch contains dozens of improvements to the game that were not available to previous players, and at least in my subjective opinion I wouldn't want every update to come with an apology or a reimbursement to players who had previously played the game, because I feel like these improvements are cause for celebration, not mourning or regret.  I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I'm guessing you wouldn't want that either?

So assuming you've come along on this journey with me up until this point, I have an alternative solution to offer you, and that's to purposefully adjust your own perspective.  Here are some questions to ask yourself that I hope will help with that:

1. Do I think the game is better with this improvement?
2. When DE made this improvement, did they take anything away from me?

I'm hoping these questions will help you realize that even though you're feeling some frustration, that you haven't been wronged; that the frustration you're feeling is the same kind of frustration a person feels when they make a purchase, only to find that 2 days later the product they purchased has gone on sale.  When you originally played the content, you decided that it was worth your time to partake in.  And it was a sensible decision on your part, because it was the best that DE had to offer at the time.  And as time has progressed, DE has had the chance to make more content, to improve their skills at creating and streamlining new content, and improve the game experience for all players.  One thing you may be able to take joy in is that you, as a long-time player, have had the chance to come along with DE and Warframe on that journey; that's not something newer players can say.  You've experienced the history of a game that you've enjoyed, and you've had the opportunity to experience it for longer than new players.

Anyway, I hope this ramble has given you some things to think about, and I hope it helps you to feel better about things. <3

[TARINunit9]

1 hour ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination missions, spy missions, or defection (yuk) missions trying to get all the parts for the warframe they wanted. 

It takes about as much time grinding the Circuit as it does grinding the original missions

[Hypernaut1]

I've been playing for years and I finally have Nidus cooking. I'm ok with it. 

[(XBOX)Lord ChibiVR]

As someone who farmed og Equinox and Ash (pre railjack), I'm all for circuit giving people easier farms.

I've skipped grinds on some frames like Harrow and Nidus using plat. Not everyone has to suffer lol

[Felsagger]

As a starting point for new players Duviri IS a gem. DE is interested on a good experience for starting players in the game. Duviri DOES that. And look who is saying this. 

Duviri gIves a lot of opportunity to new players experience new frames instead of having one for a long time until the player understands the game. 

[vanaukas]

"I suffered so ecveryone must suffer with me!!!"

heh

[BiancaRoughfin]

1 hour ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

The new Circuit game mode invalidates Warframe parts grind, and I'm torn

I felt the same way when they first announced it, it was a backstab to the 10 years i spent playing, grinding and waiting for updates to come to add new content which newbies can now just farm in very few hours.

1 hour ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

Among those rewards are warframe parts and blueprints, including frames whose parts or main blueprints are acquired only through their respective quests. While on the one hand I'm glad that new players won't have to endure the grind for parts

Im not, for me New players should go through the same processes we have been going through all these years, its not just about getting the frames, its also introducing lore to them and making sense of things. As example new players will keep hearing Sentients talking about how the Orokin made earth inhabitable yet they will run through a green livid world and be like "what gives?" as they wont have done Titania`s quest to know how Earth got green again.

1 hour ago, inappropriatename5877 said:

I can't help but feel that DE kinda spat in the face of all the players that poured days upon days grinding assassination missions, spy missions, or defection (yuk) missions trying to get all the parts for the warframe they wanted.

That and that they are throwing their own 10 years of work in the trash.

1 hour ago, Pizzarugi said:

Eh. Grinding for certain quest frames felt like an absolute chore. Nidus and Mesa comes to mind. If Circuit lets you circumvent it, I say all the power to players who go that route.

Nidus isnt that hard to get, the quest does have some tedious moments but is pretty interesting as it shows to players that not all Infestation is bad which then introduces the player to Nidus which is a frame that is infested but is on the good side.
Farming his parts can be tedious if you do on your own. When he first came out it was easy to fill up groups to farm him and get the job done quick, these days where most already have him and the Prime can be bought from another player its more likely new players will have to do it alone.

I think the problem with Mesa is the fact you need the Mutalist AladV Navs to farm her, also she has no lore, i could imagine her lore being something like Proteas with her being made to serve as a sort of Bodyguard but this doesnt explain how Alad V managed to find her or how he got her under his influence.

Also, add Ash and Oberon to that list, DE shot them self on the foot when they made those only farmable from Railjack missions, Ash especially as his parts drop from that massively nauseating Corpus ship defense map.

Oberon was an amazing frame for newer players to farm for when his parts dropped from Eximus, they could have left it that way and just reduced further the drop rates as Eximus stronghold missions would some times yield 3+ Oberon sets, Ash could still be farmed from normal missions if Manics spawned. I know they can now be farmed in Duviri but Duviri is a lore Fuster Cluck that will only make them even more confused.

2 hours ago, (PSN)Madurai-Prime said:

A game is allowed to make things easier or give alternate options for new people to grind.

Yes but they could have used what they already have instead of making something that makes previous existing forms redundant. Example they could have made a way for the odds of the player obtaining a Warframe part they dont already have to increase.

[Grommile]

2 hours ago, Tsukinoki said:

and with 53 frames and 3 choices per week works out to 18 weeks before the frame pops up again

Eleven weeks (if they aren't repeating a week because of bugs) – only 33 frames are available in the Circuit rotation. Of the 39 base frames with variants available, six are not available from the circuit:

• Equinox, presumably because her blueprints don't fit into the loot progression (she has nine instead of the normal four)
• Volt, Wukong, Banshee, Zephyr, and Nezha, presumably because their blueprints can be obtained from Dojo research.

4 minutes ago, BiancaRoughfin said:

Nidus isnt that hard to get, the quest does have some tedious moments

His quest is asinine and I refuse to complete it. (I hate the Index even when it isn't rigged.)

[Voltage]

1 hour ago, vanaukas said:

"I suffered so ecveryone must suffer with me!!!"

heh

It's kind of sad that this is the best attempt people can have as a counter argument for this kind of discussion. It happens every time, from base Trinity here to Primed Chamber. The point is not that there is an alternative, but that there is a shortcut that frankly doesn't make sense and feels wrong to be implemented in such a way.

It's the same weird feeling every time we get a Prime Warframe that is substantially easier to get compared to their base counterpart because of how trivial Fissures and earning Relics have become.

It feels like portions of the game are hollowed out to push people through the little semblance of progression Warframe has outside of Mastery.

Edited July 3, 2023 by Voltage

[Prexades]

For all the issues I have with Duviri, this bothers me the least or not at all. I am all for helping new players to catch up. Some of the earlier grinds were atrocious. Nidus and Harrow, I am looking at you.

[TARINunit9]

26 minutes ago, Voltage said:

It's kind of sad that this is the best attempt people can have as a counter argument for this kind of discussion. It happens every time, from base Trinity here to Primed Chamber. The point is not that there is an alternative, but that there is a shortcut that frankly doesn't make sense and feels wrong to be implemented in such a way.

And if OP was actually saying that, you might have a point.

But no, OP and @BiancaRoughfinare just defaulting to "*I* put in the grind, and now I feel like it was for nothing. Validate my misery by making other people miserable!" That's both REALLY STUPID to think (I have ground for literally everything in the game, and I will applaud and congratulate any new player who is given an option to grind less than I did) and not even actually true: it takes about six to eight hours of Circuit grind to hit level 10, which was actually MORE than some of the frames I ground out back in the day (with a good Limbo strat, Ivara was knocked out in 3 days, two hours a day)

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

28 minutes ago, Voltage said:

It's kind of sad that this is the best attempt people can have as a counter argument for this kind of discussion. It happens every time, from base Trinity here to Primed Chamber. The point is not that there is an alternative, but that there is a shortcut that frankly doesn't make sense and feels wrong to be implemented in such a way.

You cannot be serious in this stance of an argument. Y'all... y'all know Platinum exists, right? Y'all know it takes less than a week itself to farm up enough platinum to just buy a Warframe outright, completely skipping the direct grind for the Warframe, yes? We already had a shortcut in game that completely bypassed the torturous grind some of these Warframes are behind without an 18 long week rotation to get the specific Warframe that you want to show up and farm Duviri for. A person can earn platinum well before the Warframe they want out of Duviri even appears if they are looking for Khora, Ivara, Nidus, Ash, Titania, etc. 

Just... this is an argument that has no leg to stand on.

[vanaukas]

34 minutes ago, Voltage said:

It's kind of sad that this is the best attempt people can have as a counter argument for this kind of discussion. It happens every time, from base Trinity here to Primed Chamber. The point is not that there is an alternative, but that there is a shortcut that frankly doesn't make sense and feels wrong to be implemented in such a way.

It's the same weird feeling every time we get a Prime Warframe that is substantially easier to get compared to their base counterpart because of how trivial Fissures and earning Relics have become.

It feels like portions of the game are hollowed out to push people through the little semblance of progression Warframe has outside of Mastery.

I just don't agree. I'm glad that DE is making alternatives to obtain several things and they should keep going with that vision imo.

My progression doesn't get invalidated because someone got something easier than me.

[(PSN)FunyFlyBoy]

2 minutes ago, vanaukas said:

I just don't agree. I'm glad that DE is making alternatives to obtain several things and they should keep going with that vision imo.

My progression doesn't get invalidated because someone got something easier than me.

Hell, way I see it, this system is for both New and Veteran players because I do not have to go deal with Silver Grove, or deal with Simiaris for Limbo, Chroma, Mirage parts to chuck the completed Warframe into the Wall Pimple. Win-win I say. Everyone benefits from it. 

[Grommile]

40 minutes ago, Voltage said:

It's the same weird feeling every time we get a Prime Warframe that is substantially easier to get compared to their base counterpart because of how trivial Fissures and earning Relics have become.

You got anywhere up to a four-year head start on the people who waited for the prime.