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[DE]Rebecca

Beasts of the Sanctuary: Hotfix 22.20.8 + 22.20.8.1

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5 minutes ago, shira_nai said:

Let's make it simple. Do you agree that support classes in every single game don't have strong offensive abilities?

Nope, not making it simple because it's not that simple. There is no right or wrong there, there's cases where that applies and there's cases where it doesn't, choosing a side would just be... not very smart to say the least. Dealing in such absolutes just isn't a good way to discuss things.

But if you want an example, Mercy from Overwatch, support with no offensive abilities, more the less strong ones. She has no need for offensive abilities when her kit is very strong at supporting allies. Meanwhile other supports that aren't as effective at healing people get other different spins, some have CC, status or damage. The game does it all and it all comes down to what the game requires.

So yeah, I'm not making it simple, I won't pick a side, I'm not giving you a vote for your side.

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1 hour ago, Kitessencial said:

How so? It wasn't intended, but if it works, isn't overpowered (or just received a nerf to damage) and doesn't hurt gameplay, then why is it "bad"? 

EDIT: Or did I just oversee your sarcasm? 

No sarcasm. Exploits are bad. Even if you feel they aren't overpowered they impact the intended gameplay design choices.

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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

For consistency, damage link abilities (Trinity, Nidus, Nekros) will no longer transmit self-damage, but you will still get the damage reduction. This is particularly relevant for the healer/support class of Trinity who had become the go-to DPS frame in addition to the intended support roles. The re-release of Mods like Aviator added to some clever but ultimately uncharacteristic roles for Trinity.

BUUUUUUU!!!!!!!! BUUUUUUU!!!!! Seriously, BOOO!!!

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1 minute ago, shira_nai said:

nope. I'm just pointing out that your statement " support classes in every single game don't have strong offensive abilities" is plain wrong.

It's just your opinion.

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3 minutes ago, God_is_a_Cat_Girl said:

Nope, not making it simple because it's not that simple. There is no right or wrong there, there's cases where that applies and there's cases where it doesn't, choosing a side would just be... not very smart to say the least. Dealing in such absolutes just isn't a good way to discuss things.

But if you want an example, Mercy from Overwatch, support with no offensive abilities, more the less strong ones. She has no need for offensive abilities when her kit is very strong at supporting allies. Meanwhile other supports that aren't as effective at healing people get other different spins, some have CC, status or damage. The game does it all and it all comes down to what the game requires.

So yeah, I'm not making it simple, I won't pick a side, I'm not giving you a vote for your side.

theres case where that applies. it means THERE ARE support classes that have strong offensive abilies.
one example again from a game I play (clip isnt mine ofc), support dealing damage

 

Edited by shira_nai
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18 minutes ago, UjaAca said:

Yeah, because it is a terrible thing for support to have any damaging ability xD

I can top lane blitzcrank and almost always get 1st blood, sometime jungle steal it from me XD

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I would like to see a Khora drop %  boost aswell if it is possible  don't planning to spend a whole year in Sanctuary caused RNGsus is a badass...

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No fix for immoble Archwing/Failed Quest for Jordas Misson....Guess my friend is going to wait some time for his Atlas Frame:sad:

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1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

Fixed Decorations loving their saved rotation angles when adjusting said Decoration in the Obstacle Course.

I'm guessing this should read "leaving" instead of "loving"?

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2 minutes ago, shira_nai said:

theres case where that applies. it means THERE ARE support classes that have strong offensive abilies.
one example again from a game I play (clip isnt mine ofc), support dealing damage

You can't compare WF and Dota. Simply because in Dota there are no weapons. Your weapons - are your abilities. In WF you can complete ANY mission without using a single ability. So your point is wrong in the first place. 

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3 minutes ago, shira_nai said:

theres case where that applies. it means THERE ARE support classes that have strong offensive abilies.
one example again from a game I play, support dealing damage

DotA supports are hilariously scary because they can almost all nuke you into the ground. The notable point here is that almost all the characters in DotA fill multiple roles, and one of them is almost always damage in some capacity. Even ones meant specifically as damage dealers, carry characters like Juggernaut, Faceless Void or Anti-Mage, can heal, apply extremely strong crowd control or debuff your energy through the floor.

DotA has some great design. I suck at it, though.

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Thanks DE, but the game sometimes makes my pc crash :c i think is a bug or something similar because i'm able to run heaviest games without any crash or lag... sorry for writing it here but the support was always saying "YOUR PC IS CRAP, WARFRAME IS TOO HEAVY FOR YOU, TENNO SKOOM".... 

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Just now, Prof.549 said:

You can't compare WF and Dota. Simply because in Dota there are no weapons. Your weapons - are your abilities. In WF you can complete ANY mission without using a single ability. So your point is wrong in the first place. 

But you said support class in every single game. 

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4 minutes ago, Prof.549 said:

You can't compare WF and Dota. Simply because in Dota there are no weapons. Your weapons - are your abilities. In WF you can complete ANY mission without using a single ability. So your point is wrong in the first place. 

You can and they did. You are making pointless distinctions.

Your autoattack in DotA is your weapon, and you can augment it with various pieces of gear as the game goes on. Just like in Warframe, where some characters can do more with their weapons due to buffs, some characters can do more with their autoattack in DotA.

Edited by XaoGarrent
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I'm that I'm glad the Nuke Trinity build's no longer a thing since it was difficult to play with them in the squad, but can we get a complete Trinity overhaul along with it? I'm sorry, but doing nothing but spamming 2 with a 4  every now and then isn't my idea of engaging gameplay. She doesn't even need offensive abilities, but rather have her skills be actually fun to use and provide better buffs for the party other than just giving the ResoQuake Banshee infinite energy to nuke the entire map. Every other support Warframe provides something better than anything Trinity can provide...

 

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16 minutes ago, shira_nai said:

theres case where that applies. it means THERE ARE support classes that have strong offensive abilies.
one example again from a game I play (clip isnt mine ofc), support dealing damage

 

And I'm not saying that doesn't happen (Paladins, which I find rather bad after launch and was better in beta, has builds that turn healers into monsters), I'm just saying that it doesn't always apply or needs to apply.

 

Actually, even in the post you quoted I said that there's examples of offensive abilities on supports, I'm just not advocating for the generalization of "all or none".

Edited by God_is_a_Cat_Girl

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Well, there goes my last hope of the sanctuary getting fixed, seem another broken mechanic that will be forgotten.

Soon, the sacrifice will arrive, and everybody will forget that the sanctuary was a terrible "end game" mode that never worked.

We will get a new quest (maybe), new warframe, and new bugs, that will be forgotten like all the rest of things that didn't work (raids, eidolons, sanctuary and so on..).

DE didn't hear the feedback, and all the complaints got silenced surrounded by spores's fanboys and some sparks.

Well.... at least Fallout 76 is coming soon

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13 minutes ago, XaoGarrent said:

DotA supports are hilariously scary because they can almost all nuke you into the ground. The notable point here is that almost all the characters in DotA fill multiple roles, and one of them is almost always damage in some capacity. Even ones meant specifically as damage dealers, carry characters like Juggernaut, Faceless Void or Anti-Mage, can heal, apply extremely strong crowd control or debuff your energy through the floor.

DotA has some great design. I suck at it, though.

Yeah, thats one of the reason I really like dota. Not that I'm good at it, either 😄
 

2 minutes ago, God_is_a_Cat_Girl said:

And I'm not saying that doesn't happen, I'm just saying that it doesn't always apply or needs to apply.

"support classes in every single game don't have strong offensive abilities" is wrong, because there are supports on other games that have strong offensive abilities. He is the one that said such absolute. And I disagree with that.

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9 minutes ago, shira_nai said:

Yeah, thats one of the reason I really like dota. Not that I'm good at it, either 😄
 

"support classes in every single game don't have strong offensive abilities" is wrong, because there are supports on other games that have strong offensive abilities. He is the one that said such absolute. And I disagree with that.

Yes, and all I'm saying is that just because other supports have or can have offensive abilities it's not a reason to shove offensive abilities in every support needlessly. Trinity doesn't need it, Warframe gives options if the player wants a more varied playstyle with healing and support to (and are balanced accordingly).

Edited by God_is_a_Cat_Girl

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2 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:
  • For consistency, damage link abilities (Trinity, Nidus, Nekros) will no longer transmit self-damage, but you will still get the damage reduction. This is particularly relevant for the healer/support class of Trinity who had become the go-to DPS frame in addition to the intended support roles. The re-release of Mods like Aviator added to some clever but ultimately uncharacteristic roles for Trinity.
  •  

omae wa...

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