(The Jovian Concord: Update 25) Wisp Feedback

[Cyclouros]

1 minute ago, Phatose said:

With the community, they almost had to.  If one damaging ability - even a uselessly weak one - can damage nullifier bubbles and it's left that way, the community will start demanding other powers also be allowed to do that.

DE likes to ignore us when it suits them, i don't see the issue.

 

Also, am i the only one that likes her 4?

[Predator3174PL]

Like any Warframe can damage nullifiers bubbles with thier dmg abilities, right..? RIGHT?

[Infirito]

Tbh, don't care in the least, there's no real reason to use her 4th to begin with.

[SneakyErvin]

1 minute ago, -Bigchungus- said:

Octavia mallet and bass : am I a joke to u

I assume they work more as companions in the greater scheme of things. Much like how Venari, even though a power, can walking into and rip the face of a Nullifier while flipping his bubble the finger.

[Xavori]

Just now, Cyclouros said:

DE likes to ignore us when it suits them, i don't see the issue.

 

Also, am i the only one that likes her 4?

Honestly, it's not a question of like.  I like it.  It looks cool and it does rip through those baby seals that populate maps that I could rip through with anything else in the game as well.

The problem is that like every other purely offensive warframe ability, it's useless in situations where you are actually challenged.  It's too slow to set up, to slow to burn through strong enemies, and way, way too dangerous to actually stick yourself on the ground while waiting to burn through those enemies.  Then you add in ability immune bosses, arbitration drones, and now nullifiers.  Why the frak would anyone try to use any warframe power versus a well-modded top tier weapon?

[Cyclouros]

5 minutes ago, Predator3174PL said:

Like any Warframe can damage nullifiers bubbles with thier dmg abilities, right..? RIGHT?

Can we talk about how the corpus have the technology to render our warframes completely useless? That doesn't seem balanced.

Well, atleast hopefully we can still damage the nullifier drone that keeps the field up with sol gate

1 minute ago, Xavori said:

 Why the frak would anyone try to use any warframe power versus a well-modded top tier weapon?

Might be DE's intentions. Nothing you bring matters in Exploiter Orb/Lolalyst fights

Edited June 5, 2019 by Cyclouros

[Predator3174PL]

Just now, Cyclouros said:

Can we talk about how the corpus have the technology to render our warframes completely uesless? That doesn't seem balanced.

Yeah like, why didn't Orokin think about it when building warframes in the first place...

[zoffmode]

7 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

No other ability effects them outside of exalted weapons. 

Good point. Make Sol Gate an exalted weapon so I can FORMA AND MOD THE SUN.

[Xavori]

Just now, Cyclouros said:

Can we talk about how the corpus have the technology to render our warframes completely uesless? That doesn't seem balanced.

So do the Grineer and Infested if they chose to deploy it in quantity.  I mean, someday some Grineer commander is going to look at Vay Hek or Krill and ask why they leave the vulnerable bits.  Or an infested boss is going to grow their immune armor over the bright pink bits that we normally shoot at...

[Cyclouros]

3 minutes ago, Predator3174PL said:

Yeah like, why didn't Orokin think about it when building warframes in the first place...

They didn't even make our frame waterproof. But then again, our operators aren't waterproof either. Operators receive the same electric shock from entering water as frames do.

DE PLZ

2 minutes ago, Xavori said:

So do the Grineer and Infested if they chose to deploy it in quantity.  I mean, someday some Grineer commander is going to look at Vay Hek or Krill and ask why they leave the vulnerable bits.  Or an infested boss is going to grow their immune armor over the bright pink bits that we normally shoot at...

 

From a in-universe perspective, you can punch through any amount of armour with enough force. It's just a gameplay mechanic to stop us from killing bosses as fast as we could.
But that nullifier field is an absolute gamechanger that any intelligent leader would put on every mob.

Edited June 5, 2019 by Cyclouros

[Predator3174PL]

1 minute ago, Xavori said:

So do the Grineer and Infested if they chose to deploy it in quantity.  I mean, someday some Grineer commander is going to look at Vay Hek or Krill and ask why they leave the vulnerable bits.  Or an infested boss is going to grow their immune armor over the bright pink bits that we normally shoot at...

Do NOT give DE ideas!

[Mez999]

3 minutes ago, Cyclouros said:

Also, am i the only one that likes her 4?

I like it as well!

I think people just wanted the ultimate destroying capability but it just isn’t that. I get why - it’s the bloody sun! But it can still destroy trash mobs and strip armour with the haste mote active. 

Re the OP’s complaint, it is just bringing it in line with other abilities although I agree that it was a good selling point. 

[Xavori]

Just now, Cyclouros said:

They didn't even make our frame waterproof. But then again, our operators aren't waterproof either. Operators receive the same electric shock from entering water as frames do.

DE PLZ

And why, if our archwing's lifesupport can protect us from space and basically teleport to us if we fall in the water on sealab tilesets, does it not teleport to us during survival missions so we don't have to waste time running to those weak life support modules?

[Predator3174PL]

1 minute ago, Cyclouros said:

They didn't even make our frame waterproof. But then again, our operators aren't waterproof either. Operators receive the same electric shock from entering water as frames do.

DE PLZ

It's even funnier when Volt gets hit by electric proc. Where is logic

 

[Educated_Beast]

I was using her 4th to level up in meso relic defense runs.  I liked that I could damage nullifiers.  

I understand not being able to cast inside bubble or be affected by ranged casts like molecular prime, but this is a direct attack similar to exhaulted weapons.  

I'd rather they replace her 4th with a utility skill or just remove the bubbles.  Draco is dead now, what's the point in keeping this enemy.

[Xavori]

3 minutes ago, Cyclouros said:

They didn't even make our frame waterproof. But then again, our operators aren't waterproof either. Operators receive the same electric shock from entering water as frames do.

DE PLZ

 

From a in-universe perspective, you can punch through any amount of armour with enough force. It's just a gameplay mechanic to stop us from killing bosses as fast as we could.
But that nullifier field is an absolute gamechanger that any intelligent leader would put on every mob.

Why put it on mobs?  It's obviously an energy drain that keeps the field from staying active as it takes damage.  So if you instead mounted it into the station itself, you could cover everything while having it draw on the power's station so no amount of tenno fire could bring it down 😄

[Predator3174PL]

1 minute ago, Xavori said:

Why put it on mobs?  It's obviously an energy drain that keeps the field from staying active as it takes damage.  So if you instead mounted it into the station itself, you could cover everything while having it draw on the power's station so no amount of tenno fire could bring it down 😄

DE wants to know your location

[Cyclouros]

1 minute ago, Xavori said:

Why put it on mobs?  It's obviously an energy drain that keeps the field from staying active as it takes damage.  So if you instead mounted it into the station itself, you could cover everything while having it draw on the power's station so no amount of tenno fire could bring it down 😄

Yeah, DE clearly didn't think nullifiers through.

[Vafthrudnir]

1 hour ago, Phatose said:

With the community, they almost had to.  If one damaging ability - even a uselessly weak one - can damage nullifier bubbles and it's left that way, the community will start demanding other powers also be allowed to do that.

Which is the case, there's a lot of abilities that damage bubbles, and exalted weapons, not mesa, but gutting a meh ability was the right thing to do apparently.

[Darena_Bryant]

Dear DE:

We all know that FashionFrame is a large part of the appeal of any warframe to a lot of players. That being said, I think you overlooked reworking the various attachments for Wisps tiny body.

I just got her, and am trying to work out a look for her, and... nothing fits properly or is sized to fit properly. The chest pieces are HUGE on her, making me think of a child trying to walk around in their mommys shoes. The shoulder pieces are attaching to the middle of her biceps. Everything is WAY oversized and badly attached so far.

A thing that I have often wished for in warframe is a set of sliders for the various attachments similar to the ones for the front and back regalia that would allow for some minor resizing and repositioning from a set point. This would let players tweak their favorite attachment to sit just the way they wanted it, and save you guys having to run through all the attachments to make them fit (or not, in this case?).

When and if you have the time, please take a look at this and if possible, fix it. This has been an issue for other frames as well, where parts don't align or are outright crooked, but on Wisp it's on another level so far.

Thank you.

[Neptlude]

7 hours ago, [DE]Megan said:

Fixed Wisp’s Sol Gate ability being able to damage Nullifier bubbles (and then killing the Nullifier). This follows precedent with other Warframe abilities that were fixed (Revenant).

Why? 😧 Shouldn't the nullifier bubbles only affect void energy? Wisp solgate unleashes the SUN!! The sun isnt void energy...

I thought it was a cool detail that DE allowed the nullifier bubble to get damaged by Sol gate, since its the sun's power not wisp that was doing the damage...

 

[Teridax68]

19 hours ago, EinheriarJudith said:

so many complaints about sol gate. id actually like DE to stop making damage 4th abilities. people expecting to replace arsenal with frame powers is whats wrong. i dont mind sol gate at all it has CC (heat, radiation), deals bonus damage to alloy armor (radiation) and strips armor allowing it to do better against armor. nope people want it to delete everything it touches.

increasing the damage of this ability will make it no different than dex pixia. id rather they just replace it with something non damage than to make it into press 4 to win.

I'm inclined to agree: I think there's potential to give certain frames mode-switching damage abilities if there's genuine interaction with the rest of the kit (e.g. Exalted Blade and Radial Blind), or if there's a strong enough gate to prevent the ability from being used all the time (e.g. Baruuk's Restraint for Serene Storm), but all too often the ability boils down to "forget everything else, you're doing this thing now". When the ability does not interact with the rest of the kit, the frame becomes a fairly shallow one-ability-wonder when using it (e.g. Revenant or Titania), and when the ability has no proper gate (and Energy isn't a proper gate due to how easily it can be generated at higher levels), there's practically no reason to use anything else but the ability all of the time. Sol Gate can be used on-demand at all times and the only synergy it has with Wisp's kit is forced, so it is not surprising that it would run into those exact same issues. In the future, if DE wants to add more weapon-like abilities, they should make sure those abilities let the rest of the frame's kit breathe and still see proper use.

[EnderDDT]

Wisp is a great warframe, lots of fun and has some nice abilities. There is one problem though, something that will very likely eventually lead to it not doing so well in higher level content.

Wisp's Reservoirs do not affect allies, only warframes, despite the description saying that they do affect allies.

This may seem like a small thing till you think about her Vitality Mote specifically. This means that your warframe may be doing fine but your companion dies over and over. It means that it does nothing to help make Moas and Dogs/Cats survivable in places where they would die over and over. It means that Wisp can't be used on Sortie Defense, Eidelon Hunts, or a lot of other important high level content.

And while pets and companions are useful, that last thing (the fact that she can't be used as an actual support in high level content) is what will almost certainly consign her to the pile of mostly unused warframes.

This is a real shame, since I really do like using her; but if I have to choose between bringing a useful frame to high level content and bringing a fun but not useful frame... then I'm not going to force my team to have to carry me just so I can do my own thing. And this means I can't use Wisp like I otherwise would love to be able to.

[GhostFeng]

On 2019-06-05 at 11:32 AM, Teridax68 said:

I have mixed feelings about Wisp. On one hand, the frame itself looks phenomenal, has fantastic animations (though I wish she had her own crouch-walking animations), and has a few interesting aspects to her ability set. On the other, I think her kit doesn't really work all that well with itself, as noted by all of the forced interactions between abilities that don't really have anything to innately do with each other. On top of that, while it's less severe than on frames like Khora or Revenant, I think there's a degree of thematic dissonance to Wisp: what I expected and wanted was a subtle and unconventional warframe who used portals and ghost-like abilities in unique ways, but instead most of the time I've spent playing her boiled down to laying plants and shooting big sun lasers.

My point-by-point on the kit:

• I like the passive, and feel it has tons of potential for interesting uses in combat, though I'm not getting the best visual feedback from the effect because it doesn't seem to cloak Wisp as she's in the air (it does cloak my Sentinel, though).
• I don't like how Reservoirs play, to be honest. The static reservoirs are a drag in a game where the player is often encouraged to move from place to place, and when I do lay down a reservoir, I'm either casting the health one just to make sure I'm retaining the buff, or I cast all three at once, which takes a bit of time and busywork. The buffs themselves don't particularly seem to generate any novel or interesting gameplay, so much as make me stronger, and on top of that they take a very large amount of visual real estate with the three pods hovering around my frame. The ability itself doesn't feel especially portal-like, even if Wisp's pulling her weird plants out of some portal.
• On the flipside, I really like Will-O-Wisp. It's a simple, yet unique and versatile ability that fits well with a ghostly frame, and plays well with Wisp's passive.
• Breach Surge feels like a more fickle Radial Blind. Many others have already noted that the low status chance on the unique proc means it rarely works in regular play, and no part of the ability itself really feels appropriate to Wisp's theme or gameplay. The one aspect I liked about this ability was how Wisp could use it to teleport to her Reservoirs, which I don't think has any relevance to the ability itself.
• Sol Gate sticks out like a sore thumb on Wisp: on one hand, it's generically satisfying to fire a big laser at a crowd of enemies, but on the other, it really feels like the last effect one should be giving to Wisp. It's far too direct and clumsy for what seems to be a more elusive and ethereal frame, and it not only has poor synergy with her kit (all of its synergies are forced, i.e. the damage/Corrosive boosts with Reservoirs and modified Breach Surge status chance), but actively impedes gameplay her other abilities try to encourage, namely a focus on speed, aerial hit-and-run combat, and misdirection. It's one of those press-4-to-win abilities that dominates the frame's kit, while also making its playstyle far less deep in the process.

I mostly agree with this post and would like to add to it. I personally love Wisp and have really enjoyed using her. I'm loving this wisp/ghost theme she has going and I'd like to add some ideas that I think would make her an amazing frame, all things considered.

Passive: The idea is great, and gives her a lot of possibilities and synergy for getting the most use out of it; but I agree that it's currently difficult to visually see that it's active and working. I'd like to see her a little more obviously transparent while the passive is active.

Reservoirs: I can see how a lot of people don't like the stationary nature of the reservoirs. I think they are awesome though. Really useful for anything other than captures/exterminates where the goal is to move quickly from one destination to the next. Honestly, who needs buffs for these kinds of missions anyway? Otherwise, I personally like designating a "buff point" where my teammates and I can go to pick up or refresh the buffs. Personally, I don't like the plant theme on them though. I would love to see little floating ghost lights for the reservoirs, and little floating ghost lights for the motes hovering around the frame. You could also make them bright lights so they are easy to spot in game without having to find them on the mini map. This would better fit her wisp theme as well. As far as the buffs, I love them for their practical use. Having a huge health buff, constant close range CC and an awesome movement/melee speed buff really give her some fun capabilities. She is a really fun melee frame with all the buffs active. I do think it's weird to give a wisp/ghost frame electricity procs, but I'm not gonna argue with the awesome close range CC capability it gives her and all her teammates. 

Wil-O-Wisp: This ability looks too dam amazing. The floating ghost animation and sound effects made my jaw drop. Great job DE. I agree with some of the other complaints though that the ghost moves way too slowly. It's only useful in extremely stationary situations where you have to wait for the slow moving apparition to get to the desired place and THEN, FINALLY, you can teleport to it... It has honestly been a pain to use it to its full effectiveness because you might as well queue the elevator music while you wait for it to get somewhere. It never works when you are moving because you will always teleport behind yourself if you try to teleport while running or bullet jumping. It would be nice if it travelled a lot faster if casted while moving so that you could use it as a blink ability to move more quickly across the map. It would also look cooler and would be more fun than just bullet jumping over and over again. There is also a lot of potential for the CC (fear / confusion / decoy) and I love the synergy with her Breach Surge. Using Wil-O-Wisp and then teleporting into a crowd of enemies with an immediate blinding Breach Surge + shocking CC from her shock mote reservoir is hella fun. I just wish we could get more use out of it without waiting forever.  EDIT: Nevermind, just found out there's a hold option to make it go faster lol. That's more like it!

Breach Surge: Like I said above, this ability has been a lot of fun to use. I love the synergy with Wil-O-Wisp and also love the synergy with her reservoirs where you can teleport to them before blinding nearby enemies. I personally wish it would open blinded enemies up to finishers, giving her WAY more possibilities as a fun melee frame.

Sol Gate: I agree with all the other complaints about her 4th. It looks cool, but it's basically useless. I personally never use it and I agree that most people feel like it has no return for its cost. High energy cost + unable to use any other weapons/abilities + low damage + no other utility = useless. Here's my suggestion for a Sol Gate rework: What if her ult instead, channeled a long range version of Djinn's Fatal Attraction, drawing enemies within range towards Wisp (increases with range mods) while building a damage counter as it's channeled, accumulating more damage the longer it's channeled (increases with damage mods). Then upon pressing the ability button again, that accumulated damage is released in a massive explosion of light (the sun), damaging and blinding all enemies within range. This would be incredibly useful, fun and would fit her theme perfectly.

Go go #ghostframe!

 

 

Edited June 14, 2019 by GhostFeng

[giglyfoot]

Wisp Specters currently DO NOT use skills. They basically jus run around, rarely shooting.