The new speedrun Nightwave challenge is exactly what this game needed

[GreyDeath789]

2 hours ago, dsagent said:

I am talking about the:

"Finish a Capture mission in less than 90 seconds"

It is better to reward players on skill / overcoming a challenge as opposed to mindlessly grinding for a goal.

Personally I would have preferred 60 seconds instead but this is a good start.

I hope this is a prelude of good things to come. Very refreshing.

This challenge isn't good...not in the way described...

2 hours ago, (PS4)ARC_Paroe said:

S P E E D M E T A harshly punishes people who dont or cant subscribe to it though. I havent done it yet, but if it turns out 90 seconds requires a speedframe build and a specific mission node... thats simply bad design. 

DE really shouldnt fall into the path of exile trap. 

While not a speed "meta" requirement it does seem to push people to Earth or some other early capture node to make it cheesy.

The stats DE should show on this challenge is which node was used to complete it and then decide if the goal for challenges (Nightwave or others) is to push players to a low level node so they can be cheesed.

Is it really a "challenge" if players simply go to Mantle to run it? Doesn't that change the challenge from skills-based to node knowledge-based? How much of a challenge is that then really?

A better challenge for Nightwave would be Sleds of Sunshine in revamped PoE...

 

[Danielw8]

2 hours ago, (PS4)ARC_Paroe said:

S P E E D M E T A harshly punishes people who dont or cant subscribe to it though. I havent done it yet, but if it turns out 90 seconds requires a speedframe build and a specific mission node... thats simply bad design. 

DE really shouldnt fall into the path of exile trap. 

good joke

 

[(PSN)CrazyBeaTzu]

It took 3 seconds, relax lol. We already do speed runs anyways. I always run capture and exterminate fissures with my 2.27 Sprint Loki.

[GreyDeath789]

2 hours ago, (PS4)ARC_Paroe said:

S P E E D M E T A harshly punishes people who dont or cant subscribe to it though. I havent done it yet, but if it turns out 90 seconds requires a speedframe build and a specific mission node... thats simply bad design. 

DE really shouldnt fall into the path of exile trap. 

Maybe...

1 hour ago, (NSW)Greybones said:

Isn’t this challenge a gear check? 🤔 

It doesn’t sound difficult to do, but that’s because I can do a capture on Earth with my OP equipment. The gear check may be small, but it’s there.

If my observation is correct, does this reflect what many are looking for? Enough damage numbers to do a thing faster?

Maybe...

1 minute ago, (PS4)CrazyBeaTzu said:

It took 3 seconds, relax lol. We already do speed runs anyways. I always run capture and exterminate fissures with my 2.27 Sprint Loki.

Apparently yes a speed meta gear check challenge.

[(PSN)ARC_Paroe]

5 minutes ago, GreyDeath789 said:

This challenge isn't good...not in the way described...

While not a speed "meta" requirement it does seem to push people to Earth or some other early capture node to make it cheesy.

The stats DE should show on this challenge is which node was used to complete it and then decide if the goal for challenges (Nightwave or others) is to push players to a low level node so they can be cheesed.

Is it really a "challenge" if players simply go to Mantle to run it? Doesn't that change the challenge from skills-based to node knowledge-based? How much of a challenge is that then really?

A better challenge for Nightwave would be Sleds of Sunshine in revamped PoE...

 

Speed meta is a slippery slope, and not a good place to be; Its very, very, very easy to fall into the trap of building upwards instead of outwards, where every 'new' challenge is really just "do you have X amount of DPS/speed/mobility. 

Speaking of plains, why dont we have Archwing obstacle courses put on for us by the ostrons, who we are local superheros to?

[(PSN)ARC_Paroe]

3 minutes ago, GreyDeath789 said:

Maybe...

Maybe...

Apparently yes a speed meta gear check challenge.

Hey im seeing a lot of negative comments towards my speed meta comment and let me explain it; 
It is better to reward players on skill / overcoming a challenge as opposed to mindlessly grinding for a goal.
Is the kind of logic that e-1337 players in path of exile use to excuse content that purposefully excludes non-optimal or slow builds, and its a very slippery slope once you start thinking like that because if youre NOT already a meta player you likely dont have the same tools and methods available to you, and while this IS a game where you can acquire those tools simply it would still absolutely suck if DE released an event where you needed a kuva bramma+volt with 200% ability strength to complete it or be forced to sit out. 

Speed is a meta chaser thing, and after doing the mission its definitely easily doable - although on console it can be rough because you get stuck on a lot due to a lack of fine control.

[(PSN)CrazyBeaTzu]

6 minutes ago, GreyDeath789 said:

Maybe...

Maybe...

Apparently yes a speed meta gear check challenge.

Is Ceres a Meta Gear Check Challenge since it's harder than Earth?

Is Sedna a Meta Gear Check Challenge because it's harder than Ceres? 

When/Why/What/How is something a gear check? And why does this even matter in the first place?

[(PSN)CrazyBeaTzu]

2 hours ago, (PS4)ARC_Paroe said:

S P E E D M E T A harshly punishes people who dont or cant subscribe to it though. I havent done it yet, but if it turns out 90 seconds requires a speedframe build and a specific mission node... thats simply bad design. 

DE really shouldnt fall into the path of exile trap. 

It's not bad design if a person runs into every wall. That's bad player design lol. Every content in every game requires something. That is what games are.....You're not supposed to be able to beat any game with level 1 gear. 

[GreyDeath789]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)CrazyBeaTzu said:

Is Ceres a Meta Gear Check Challenge since it's harder than Earth?

Is Sedna a Meta Gear Check Challenge because it's harder than Ceres? 

When/Why/What/How is something a gear check? And why does this even matter in the first place?

Ask the guy with the 2.27 Loki build about the gear check...not me.

Some people feel the speed run nature of this challenge is a gear check...it may benefit from a speed build but is easy enough on the low level nodes or with a stealth frame (which is a type of gear check)...

This type of challenge could be left in the profile list of challenges instead of Nightwave and people would still do it...

[Talinthis]

i was doing capture fissures with randoms and we ended up completing it. didnt even know it was a thing.

[(PSN)CrazyBeaTzu]

33 minutes ago, GreyDeath789 said:

Ask the guy with the 2.27 Loki build about the gear check...not me.

Some people feel the speed run nature of this challenge is a gear check...it may benefit from a speed build but is easy enough on the low level nodes or with a stealth frame (which is a type of gear check)...

This type of challenge could be left in the profile list of challenges instead of Nightwave and people would still do it...

Yea sure....dont know what to tell you, everything in any game is a gear check. That's why there are "tiers" to content.

Kind of think of a wedding cake lol.

[GreyDeath789]

Just now, (PS4)CrazyBeaTzu said:

Yea sure....dont know what to tell you, everything in any game is a gear check. That's why there are "tiers" to content.

Kind of think of a wedding cake lol.

*shudder* Wedding cakes just make me think of divorce lawyers...

Since Warframe doesn't have "tiers" not sure that gear check theory works but understand your intent.

[nslay]

1 hour ago, GreyDeath789 said:

While not a speed "meta" requirement it does seem to push people to Earth or some other early capture node to make it cheesy.

I think Void's Capture nodes make this pretty easy too (as long as you don't get an elevator!). And you get a relic for your 90 or less seconds of time. This is where I completed my challenge anyway!

1 hour ago, GreyDeath789 said:

A better challenge for Nightwave would be Sleds of Sunshine in revamped PoE...

I think this would make a nice Elite Challenge:

 

[Butterfly85]

Speed meta ... wat? I did this first time with Hildryn. No speed mods needed. Just run the earth map and you're good.

[Zsword]

After seeing people call this a gear check I decided to go full try hard and see just how feasible this was with the worst possible circumstances:

Unmodded Atlas (the slowest frame in the game)

Unmodded Mk1 Braton. (I'm not sure if it's the 'worst' gun but it's probably the worst unmodded gun.)

Results: 

4 seconds to spare and I didn't even throw a punch (0 Abilities used). This was on the first capture node on the star chart. Can't really say this is gear gated when it's very possible with gear that's actively detrimental to the objective. (though I didn't consider hobbled, hobbled mostly affects your sprint speed when most of your movement is bullet jumping.)

[(NSW)Sniperfox47]

People who are calling this nightwave challenge a gear check or speed meta need to actually try the mission lol x'D I just did it in 1:20 with an unranked unmodded Excalibur and an rank 30 but unmodded skana. And that's including getting caught on the terrain for a good 10-15 seconds because I was dumb.

This challenge needs only basic understanding of bullet jumping and rolling. Outside of that it's just a matter of not getting caught on terrain like I did.

[SenorClipClop]

4 hours ago, (PS4)ARC_Paroe said:

S P E E D M E T A harshly punishes people who dont or cant subscribe to it though.

I understand the sentiment, but sentiments like this are often why we can't have nice things.

Devs release a challenging element to keep us entertained, a group of players complains that it's unfair because it isn't already in their comfort zone, and DE diminishes the element to the point to where it becomes trivial to those who enjoyed the original challenge. Arbitrations being the key example here.

For this 90-second Nightwave task, maybe try it before being so ready to call it bad design. It's doable without a speed setup. But even if it wasn't so doable, would it be so terrible? You don't need every challenge to get to Rank 30, and it wouldn't be much of an Elite task if any ol' Tenno did it accidentally, would it?

[kamisama85]

Optional content should have no difficulty ceiling and should definitely explore more challenges like this one to force hardcore players to become more creative. Being optional content means nobody is missing out on anything if they cannot complete it. It will be reserved for the truly determined player wanting to push themselves to the max. I certainly hope more challenges like this are added as a way of pushing ourselves to be better, faster, and stronger beyond the abilities, weapons, and mods.

If there are to be any 'rewards', probably just in the form of an acheivement or sigil/glyph. Nothing more.

[0_The_F00l]

I liked it, 

I don't think it was worthy of being an elite challenge but I do not have any significant complaints. 

Managed with an Equinox on earth without issues and was just curious if any other nodes are difficult, 

Did cassini (saturn) with 10 seconds to spare . 

Gonna check against some other nodes. 

No special modding done. 

 

Also complaining about optional challenges in a game with very many playstyles is not necessary , but requesting them to be removed is downright dumb. 

[Wolfdoggie]

I went in with full power/sprint Volt and it spawned me at the exit and the capture target was in my hand with no clothing, hair or skin left on his body but still alive thankfully. Too much speed. 😩

Edited May 13, 2020 by Wolfdoggie

[(PSN)Jason_V_Jade]

This mission type is clearly for meth.. err I mean volt or gauss users.

I'll pass, lol

[(NSW)Greybones]

(deleted)

Edited May 13, 2020 by (NSW)Greybones
Boop

[Alpha56]

i did it with a hobbled dragon key on the first try.

Should have been bellow 60s.

[(NSW)Sniperfox47]

2 hours ago, SenorClipClop said:

I understand the sentiment, but sentiments like this are often why we can't have nice things.

Devs release a challenging element to keep us entertained, a group of players complains that it's unfair because it isn't already in their comfort zone, and DE diminishes the element to the point to where it becomes trivial to those who enjoyed the original challenge. Arbitrations being the key example here.

For this 90-second Nightwave task, maybe try it before being so ready to call it bad design. It's doable without a speed setup. But even if it wasn't so doable, would it be so terrible? You don't need every challenge to get to Rank 30, and it wouldn't be much of an Elite task if any ol' Tenno did it accidentally, would it?

With regards to challenging elements, there is definitely a place for that. By all means add it in. But a time limited event that most likely these players will never get another opportunity to experience is not that time and place.

Why do I always see the push for higher difficulty in operations, Nightwave and the like? Why was there this massive push for "moar challenge" in Scarlet Spear and now again in NW3? These are time limited events that the difficulty curve is only serving to lock newer players out and prevent them from experiencing a once in a lifetime event. (Yes I know they said they'll re-run Scarlet Spear, but they never indicated that prior to the event leaving on PC).

You want more difficulty? Add onto the existing starchart, add a new star chart, add new permanent game modes, add in support for scaling enemy AI, by all means I'd love to see all of that stuff.

But Nightwave is supposed to be a replacement for alerts. It's supposed to drop feed newer players the resources they need such as MR0 weapons, Aura Mods, Nitain, Catalysts and Reactors. It's the place for simple missions that introduce different game mods, not the place for Railjack missions and Eidolons who have a massive quest lockout. It's not the place for Profit Taker buried behind an insurmountable rep grind.

 

That being said, a minute and a half for a capture is fine. It can be done with starting equipment pretty easily if you just learn to bullet jump.

Edited May 13, 2020 by (NSW)Sniperfox47

[vegetosayajin]

7 hours ago, (PS4)ARC_Paroe said:

S P E E D M E T A harshly punishes people who dont or cant subscribe to it though. I havent done it yet, but if it turns out 90 seconds requires a speedframe build and a specific mission node... thats simply bad design. 

DE really shouldnt fall into the path of exile trap. 

um full bs... i finish both the void captures with normal excal in 60 seconds
for less than that you need a speed frame(or op with a good setup 😄 )

.....................


did they really go and put in rj stuff in nightwave tho?