Heart of Deimos: New Syndicates & Economy Feedback Megathread

[Xyhon]

12 minutes ago, Her_Lovely_Tentacles said:

Otak seems a bit confused...

Even though I am a woman, he refers to me as "King".
Hearing him misgender me is quite irritating, as it turns a line that is meant as praise into... some sort of a mocking. It's also some sort of mocking proof that women are still underrepresented in gaming.

Now, it could be changed based on operator gender, which would be a slight improvement, but that still doesn't sit right, because that'd just throw enbies under the bus then. (Something like: "Who's awesome? That's right, you're awesome!" might be a better fit)

Maybe this could be looked at.

 

If you have to be that specific, there were women who were crowned kings. 

[LuckyCharm]

Was it really necessary for multiple token types? I like the token idea that we can bank them and build up more than a days standing with them but the brother/sister/father tokens are pretty much just the same as saving up fish, ore,e etc as usual for trading in later. Just a single token type would have been fine. Now.. Well now its just needlessly complicated.  

Thanks. I hate it. 

[kyori]

1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

We are getting a fix and (along with general Son Token rebalance) in for this today.

Thanks. But I hope you all are increasing the spawn/drop rate to much more instead of reducing their crafting amount for various stuffs. Because if the spawn/drop rate doesn't significantly improved, lowering the crafting amount isn't going to help much. I think you knew this fact.

As of now, I still have yet to encounter any in the vault area.

[ScarlettQueen]

11 minutes ago, Xyhon said:

If you have to be that specific, there were women who were crowned kings. 

You're right. Hatshepsut, who reigned in Egypt around 1479 - 1458 BCE, styled herself Pharaoh, as if she was male. Sorry, history student plug. Shoot me.

[Kai]

1 hour ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

General note re: Scintillant! We discussed it yesterday, and realized the Scintillant description was too vague in terms of other methods to acquire it and updated its description in a Hotfix. Overnight, we ran stats and the amount collected was too low, which is widely accepted from the community to be the case. While we all start with baseline ‘0’ for new Updates, this Resource is an outlier in how slowly it’s being accrued, which is to say current pacing not our intention. They should feel like a revised Cetus Wisp, but when we compared the two overnight, and considering more people are playing Heart of Deimos and how many Scintillant are needed, they were lower to a degree that doesn’t make sense with their hookup. We are getting a fix and (along with general Son Token rebalance) in for this today.

Any chance you can make it so that Bad, Good, and Perfect captures for Conservation has a purpose in this open world? At least 1 tag for Bad and 2 for Good and 3 for Perfect would be nice.

Also, please increase the spawn rate of Scintillant - if this was the case of a revised Cetus Wisp where you can pick it up at any point in PoE, make it more available outside of Isolation Vaults because there's always at least one Cetus Wisp per session in PoE that you can pick up.

[mell0w_dy]

2 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

They should feel like a revised Cetus Wisp, but when we compared the two overnight, and considering more people are playing Heart of Deimos and how many Scintillant are needed, they were lower to a degree that doesn’t make sense with their hookup. We are getting a fix and (along with general Son Token rebalance) in for this today.

I don't need to do a higher-level bounty to farm wisps, I just need to go explore the open world. That's not a great revision, and up until this hopeful fix, we're seeing that play out.

Enjoying the update so far, but glad you're looking into this farm. Hopefully it becomes remotely bearable soon.

[Stormhaven13]

On 2020-08-26 at 12:40 AM, Stormhaven13 said:

Personally love the token system, I'm fairly active right now, but when I'm not I can use the tokens to build up over time so I can still level up the syndicate when I don't have time to really play.

Father Tokens are generally fine, but I don't have a sense of how rare the bounty resource is, but honestly I don't think that matters.

Mother Tokens are great, and despite what everyone seems to think, gives you about the same standing as normal bounties.

Daughter Tokens seem alright, but Daughter herself seems pretty badly bugged right now, and doesn't give consistent amounts of fish supplies. Once that's fixed, those should be more than fine.

Son Tokens. They're better than what most people are saying, most people just don't like having to pay attention for animals during mission, which I suppose is fair. I do think that his tokens are fairly expensive/luck based given that conservation seems to take the longest of any of the activities. I don't really mind, but I know a lot of other people do. 

Grandmother Tokens is a good system, rewards you for patience and doing a variety of things, people just seem confused that you DO NOT NEED THEM. You get plenty of standing from just doing Mother Bounties, and only need as many tokens as the Rank Ups require. 

The Rank Up requirements needing blueprints from the syndicate is. Kind of weird? I don't really care, it's basically just "you need this much extra standing", but thematically I don't really understand it.

This doesn't personally affect me, but thank you for updating the Syndicate Standing system. People complaining about not getting anything while new players get something is just. Drives me crazy. This lets everyone experience the content faster, and there is nothing bad about that. I have always hesitated to get my friends into this game because of how long it would take to do the really cool things, and this helps with that so much.

Overall, the bugs have affected my ability to engage with the system, which is incredibly frustrating, but mostly understandable as long as they get fixed quickly, as some of them (Fish Cutting, and the inability to craft mutagens come to mind first) make Deimos unplayable for me. However, once they get fixed, I think this will easily be my favorite open world. I love both of the other ones, and this one takes the systems and mistakes of the other two, and massively improves on all of them. I'm excited to see what the finished product looks like over the next few weeks.

After playing more, and listening to other people, I do think Son tokens are WAY too expensive for the rewards they currently get, and in general given how easy it is to get hundreds of Mother tokens, all the other tokens should be worth more as well. I do think that Father tokens costing Scintillant, in its current state, is absolutely ridiculous. If you don't increase the drop rate A LOT, and you absolutely should, he should not need any, ever. It is way too rare of a resource to be needed by something that gives somewhere between 100 and 500 standing. I still do think its fair that you have to do a variety of things to rank up in the open world.

[Shinobi-X-Zero]

2 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

General note re: Scintillant! We discussed it yesterday, and realized the Scintillant description was too vague in terms of other methods to acquire it and updated its description in a Hotfix. Overnight, we ran stats and the amount collected was too low, which is widely accepted from the community to be the case. While we all start with baseline ‘0’ for new Updates, this Resource is an outlier in how slowly it’s being accrued, which is to say current pacing not our intention. They should feel like a revised Cetus Wisp, but when we compared the two overnight, and considering more people are playing Heart of Deimos and how many Scintillant are needed, they were lower to a degree that doesn’t make sense with their hookup. We are getting a fix and (along with general Son Token rebalance) in for this today.

Make a token trade for rare resources with a limited time and amounts like the token system, this will helpful the player with high amount of tokens and nothing to do with them, or put in the Grandma shop to a early simple solution.

[GEN-Son_17]

1 hour ago, kaotis said:

For you guys it would have been correct to send you the expansion after the hotfixes hit and were tested... I never understood why the whole "Release on all plataforms at once" we all knew there were some intense bugs all over the place... now consoles will get a poor experience for at least a weak until the cert and all the hoops M$ , Sony and i'm guessing nintendo(this ones must be the real A Holes out of all 3 from how they act with everyone) are done 😞  

I think it's because DE wanted it to be as little spoilers as possible at launch. By the time consoles get it, streams and youtubers would already have explained and spoiled the entire update. The biggest issue with that lies with people complaining about something they've not even played yet but, instead, complain through the youtube video. That toxic "spoil and spread" type of behavior is exactly why DE can't risk mainline test clusters but would also risk a mass update. Some people just can't enjoy without spoiling.

[Aerionoth]

Son's token economy is so hilariously unbalanced it stops being funny anymore.

• wildlife capture quality doesn't affect token return. A perfect capture deserves a reward, and since you've decided to [censored] everyone that liked to capture doggos for standing, at least give us 3 tokens for perfect captures.
• fish size doesn't affect the amount of materials after cutting (if it does, I can't see it)
• I get that Scintillant is meant to be the wisp of Deimos, but remember: wisps spawned in the world in predictable locations, you could farm it. This thing is needed in large quantities and after all the time I've played, I have a grand total of 1 (one). EDIT- I see you're working on this already, thank you.
• there might be more resources I haven't noticed, but at least the Fass and Vome Residue is unaffected by the resource booster.

I'd like to also add that random-cost tokens are a bit annoying when it comes to progression, but it should be fine in the long run as a passive thing. However, for those that want or need specific tokens right now, a flat conversion rate (bit higher than the random cost ones) should be considered, something that's always present and doesn't have you wait X hours to MAYBE be able to purchase it.

[Tesseract7777]

1 hour ago, Her_Lovely_Tentacles said:

Otak seems a bit confused...

Even though I am a woman, he refers to me as "King".
Hearing him misgender me is quite irritating, as it turns a line that is meant as praise into... some sort of a mocking. It's also some sort of mocking proof that women are still underrepresented in gaming.

Now, it could be changed based on operator gender, which would be a slight improvement, but that still doesn't sit right, because that'd just throw enbies under the bus then. (Something like: "Who's awesome? That's right, you're awesome!" might be a better fit)

Maybe this could be looked at.

 

I've always thought Queen was sort of a sexist term in a way though. 

Just like how many female actors today prefer to simply be called an actor and not actress, or a female waiter would prefer you just call her a waiter and not a waitress. 

Usually, you never have a king and queen ruling at the same time, it's one or the other based on birthright. However, in many kingdoms, it was common practice that the oldest female only got a chance at the throne if there were literally no male heirs. And while she got to rule the kingdom, she still wasn't on the same level as a male. Not only does she not ascend to the throne if there are any male heirs, even if they are younger and inferior to her, but if she does get to be coronated, she has to have the lesser, female designed title of "queen" instead. 

The separate female titles are from an archaic time in humanity when woman were treated like property, and even when they were allowed to work or reached some level of power, they were still not allowed the same titles as men in order to show their "place" in society. Calling women kings would, imo, actually be a step forward for feminism in general -- which unless you are talking about radicals, literally just means equality. 

[unagi_tsukino]

4 hours ago, killerJoke66 said:

Diversity for activities is cool in itself NOT when you force that sht,  blantly saying.

You can always go play Fortnite or whatever. Nobody's forcing you

[fr4gb4ll]

isolation vaults...

idk if you devs ever even tried this mission with some random players and not just with those who developed it, but recommend you do - then you'll see what the map/waypoint system really lacks (and that for ages now). if only one of the team gets lost but even one procedes along the wp's, then the 'lost' ones will have a hard time finding their way around - which is especially funny when the team is waiting at the last door for the full team to asemble... and yes, if you done this mission a few dozent times you probably won't have any difficulties anymore - but then remove the option for open matchmaking else you always get one or more players who didn't do this all day long.

ofc, you could also just let the door open as soon as even one player gets there and then let them also extract alone (else the lost players gets even more screwed) but better yet, think of a new way for the waypoint and the map to work without leading the players the wrong way...

[killerJoke66]

4 minutes ago, Derpetrator said:

You can always go play Fortnite or whatever. Nobody's forcing you

question mark ? weird attack 

I would give my honest feedback for what i think of would be a betterment for the game , regardless of what people like you would think about it . Also funny that you mention fortnite in the warframe forum when the game itself is more casual than fortnite in actuality , even tho i dont play it doesnt mean i can call you out the bs you spout randomly. 

[RingoDesu]

2 hours ago, [DE]Rebecca said:

General note re: Scintillant! We discussed it yesterday, and realized the Scintillant description was too vague in terms of other methods to acquire it and updated its description in a Hotfix. Overnight, we ran stats and the amount collected was too low, which is widely accepted from the community to be the case. While we all start with baseline ‘0’ for new Updates, this Resource is an outlier in how slowly it’s being accrued, which is to say current pacing not our intention. They should feel like a revised Cetus Wisp, but when we compared the two overnight, and considering more people are playing Heart of Deimos and how many Scintillant are needed, they were lower to a degree that doesn’t make sense with their hookup. We are getting a fix and (along with general Son Token rebalance) in for this today.

Please, if we are to have a rebalance on Son Token, it that gets twice as much from exchaging the label, grant us twice the amount of existing Token in our inventory! Thanks 

[VI0L3TF0X]

There is one Avichaea lure spot at the edge of the map that makes spawns really unclear, the lure spot is under an infested blob and the creatures that are not big tend to spawn above it or against a bright red pulsating surface, which makes them insanely hard to spawn
https://imgur.com/a/uG8uIWG
https://imgur.com/a/OYV06Mw
Second thing is (i don't know if it's intended) but there are 1-3 tracking spots for Avichaeas/Vulpaphylas and once you complete one it doesn't spawn another one in it's place, which makes mass-capturing one species tedious as you have to reset every time.

Third thing would be with one bounty objective, you have to gather and then transfer data, but the timer doesn't scale with squad size so it's impossible to complete the bonus objective.

Other than that update's been really great, I'm having lots of fun exploring the new open word 😄
 

[Tenno26938]

On 2020-08-26 at 2:00 AM, Wyrmius_Prime said:

So the next rankup requires weapon part blueprints now? WHO THE HELL DESIGNED THIS BS? 

oh it gets better! because these weapons cost standing to buy! and the necroloid wants them too, nice way to artifically pad out the grind with hidden expenses DE!

[unagi_tsukino]

10 minutes ago, killerJoke66 said:

question mark ? weird attack 

I would give my honest feedback for what i think of would be a betterment for the game , regardless of what people like you would think about it . Also funny that you mention fortnite in the warframe forum when the game itself is more casual than fortnite in actuality , even tho i dont play it doesnt mean i can call you out the bs you spout randomly. 

Yes, it is more casual. that's what makes it fun.  It also has a much wider range. Like in many games of this type if you're set on hating anything non-combat related chances are eventually you will have to do something you don't like. And even now that DE gave you not one but two alternatives to those activities people still are complaining that it's not enough

I swear there's too many people who keep playing this game that seem to dislike its core principles. Hence Fortnite. Same combat related thing to do over and over. If you can't stomach anything else, just go do that

 

[EinheriarJudith]

7 minutes ago, Derpetrator said:

Yes, it is more casual. that's what makes it fun.  It also has a much wider range. Like in many games of this type if you're set on hating anything non-combat related chances are eventually you will have to do something you don't like. And even now that DE gave you not one but two alternatives to those activities people still are complaining that it's not enough

I swear there's too many people who keep playing this game that seem to dislike its core principles. Hence Fortnite. Same combat related thing to do over and over. If you can't stomach anything else, just go do that

 

the core princile is to kill enemies and get loot, not go fishing, animal rescue, cave dive for minerals. there is no alternative to ranking up. you need to do mining, fishing, conservasion, and bounties. 

they should have used what they already made since they updated plains of eidolon to be like fortuna.

[sorcer3r]

Do we get paid in platinum for grinding those ranks ?  Was really looking forward to play with the helminth system... it just feels like a second job to unlock it.

Maybe let us buy the helminth system???

[killerJoke66]

11 minutes ago, Derpetrator said:

Yes, it is more casual. that's what makes it fun.  It also has a much wider range. Like in many games of this type if you're set on hating anything non-combat related chances are eventually you will have to do something you don't like. And even now that DE gave you not one but two alternatives to those activities people still are complaining that it's not enough

I swear there's too many people who keep playing this game that seem to dislike its core principles. Hence Fortnite. Same combat related thing to do over and over. If you can't stomach anything else, just go do that

 

i dont think hunting is or should be one of the game's 'core' principles . (just giving a perspective) I like hunting occasionally , few hunts if i feel bored .I'm not against having mini games , theyre cool and fun , it becomes not fun for me and for some people that if you want something none hunting related but still you have to exactly get specific hunting tags or else theres no choice for ranking up to get things that are not related to any of the triangle (fishing/hunting/mining)

[(XBOX)AMONGTHEWEAK]

As soon as I unlock Helminth I don't see myself grinding anymore standing or doing anymore conservation, unless there is some hidden resource we need in helminth that requires more conservation tasks.

[ConsumerJTC]

The scintillant does not drop as often as the fetus wisps at all.

Running the T2 bounty for hours on end and not recieving more in the time invested is quite jarring.

[killerJoke66]

I would actually do more deimos with the steel path level 5 bounty because i actually like fighting against those new infesteds , this time content stands out for itself (_{again imo)}and not just for rewards . 
Also with this new bounty rewards i can imagine new players being happy with the acolyte mods and whatnot , though i think they gave them basically for free but hey improvement is improvement  , now we can also have some new set of mods and some kuva rewards for basically doing high level missions. 

[unagi_tsukino]

14 minutes ago, EinheriarJudith said:

the core princile is to kill enemies and get loot, not go fishing, animal rescue, cave dive for minerals. there is no alternative to ranking up. you need to do mining, fishing, conservasion, and bounties. 

they should have used what they already made since they updated plains of eidolon to be like fortuna.

Isolation vaults and requiem pillars give you minerals and fish parts. Combat only