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improve new player experience - slow down equipment unlocks


xX-Kuro-Xx
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This came up in another thread, but I think it's worth bubbling to the top.

Warframe seems to lose lots of new players very early. If you watch video reviews, it seems possible that this is because of paradox of choice - with the star-chart having too many choices, and too much Lander equipment thrown at the player too fast. This review paints the picture well...

  Josh Strife Hayes Reviews Warframe

Here is a proposal to slow down equipment introduction and let players focus on one element at a time, without compromising the game...

1. Make a new massively simpler "guided Navigation" feature that opens over the star-chart, which presents the player with 3 *visibly giant* mission card buttons that are progression appropriate, show a picture of the faction, a clear label of the mission type, and the *reason* the player is doing the mission. This is conceptually similar to the mission-alerts in the upper-right, but the idea is to actually HIDE/defer/replace the actual star-chart.. so players don't have to handle the huge paradox-of-choice it presents. Instead, they will just see three mission offers. 

2. Better introduce Weapon Mods as part of the initial questline. Unlock the Mod station first, guide the player to place some weapon mods in between each linear quest section, before they open up Navigation or anything else on their ship. Weapon mods are arguably the most important element to early progression, and they currently get lost with all the other equipment unlocks that slam in on the player. 

3. Push the Foundry and Market unlocks to the 2nd planet. Issue all the MK1 weapons either in the starting quest, or as drops on the starting planet, and make them not take weapon slots (so the player can get them without the Market). After the player makes it to Venus, introduce the Foundry first (to craft a weapon), and the Market (to buy a weapon slot with "free starter plat")

4. Push the foundry-plat-speedup mechanic introduction much later. (to MR10?) It sends the wrong message, and if new players are fooled into actually clicking the button to spend plat on this, most of them will eventually regret it and be mad at DE for having it in the game. 

That last point deserves some special attention...

I remember when I came to the "pay to speedup foundry builds" super early in Warframe, and all I could think was... "seriously? we're now doing iOS Dungeon Keeper Microtransactions garbage?"  I almost quit right there, but I decided to just ignore that mechanic and see what happens, and I'm glad I did, because I played another 700 hours after that. I  spent money on slots and colors, but I have *never* paid to speed up a foundry build, and I don't think many others players have either. 

In my opinion, no game should have *consumable* microtransactions. Sell us all the durable virtual goods you want... Colors. Frames. Weapons. Slots. Feature Unlocks. Etc. But get rid of the idiotic consumable "foundry speedup for real money". Most people are smart enough either to never use it, or to quit the game.. and if they are not smart enough, they will quit the game when they realize they were tricked by the developer into spending real money on something totally pointless and unnecessary. It sends the wrong message. It scares people away. And it's entirely unnecessary. 

 

 

Edited by xX-Kuro-Xx
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  1. If you want the dev team to see this, you'll want to move it to the Feedback section of the forums.  General Discussion is where players write fan-fiction about game mechanics, and devs understandably don't wade through it.
     
  2. We've really got to stop linking to and paraphrasing Josh Strife Hayes videos.  He's got some smart things to say but instead of saying that he said them — or worse, expecting others to watch a 15-30 minute video to truly understand your post — just say the thing.  If it's a valid and meaningful thing to say, it will stand on its own merit.
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8 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

Make a new massively simpler "guided Navigation" feature that opens over the star-chart, which presents the player with 3 *visibly giant* mission card buttons that are progression appropriate, show a picture of the faction, a clear label of the mission type, and the *reason* the player is doing the mission. This is conceptually similar to the mission-alerts in the upper-right, but the idea is to actually HIDE/defer/replace the actual star-chart.. so players don't have to handle the huge paradox-of-choice it presents. Instead, they will just see three mission offers.

If you watched the last devstream you should know there's going to be something like that

8 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

Better introduce Weapon Mods as part of the initial questline. Unlock the Mod station first, guide the player to place some weapon mods in between each linear quest section, before they open up Navigation or anything else on their ship. Weapon mods are arguably the most important element to early progression, and they currently get lost with all the other equipment unlocks that slam in on the player

I was kinda surprised when I discovered some people didn't know modding existed, don't you have to install the mod segment at Vor's prize I guess they could force you to open the mod menu if they don't already.

10 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

Foundry stuff

 

7 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

So what almost turned you down was the pay to rush not the waiting? What difference does it make to you if you're willing to wait no issues but you're bothered by the option to rush it?

Who knows how much money DE makes from rushing, it's still there so clearly makes them some profit

 

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7 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

This came up in another thread, but I think it's worth bubbling to the top.

Warframe seems to lose lots of new players very early. If you watch video reviews, it seems obvious this is because the game throws too much Lander equipment at the player too fast. This review paints the picture well...

  Josh Strife Hayes Reviews Warframe

Here is a proposal to slow down equipment introduction and let players focus on one element at a time, without compromising the game...

1. Make a new massively simpler "guided Navigation" feature that opens over the star-chart, which presents the player with 3 *visibly giant* mission card buttons that are progression appropriate, show a picture of the faction, a clear label of the mission type, and the *reason* the player is doing the mission. This is conceptually similar to the mission-alerts in the upper-right, but the idea is to actually HIDE/defer/replace the actual star-chart.. so players don't have to handle the huge paradox-of-choice it presents. Instead, they will just see three mission offers. 

2. Better introduce Weapon Mods as part of the initial questline. Unlock the Mod station first, guide the player to place some weapon mods in between each linear quest section, before they open up Navigation or anything else on their ship. Weapon mods are arguably the most important element to early progression, and they currently get lost with all the other equipment unlocks that slam in on the player. 

3. Push the Foundry and Market unlocks to the 2nd planet. Issue MK1 weapons as drops on the starting planet, and make them not take weapon slots (so the player can get them without the Market). 

4. Remove the foundary-plat-to-speedup mechanic. Either entirely, or until MR 10 or some point where players have the perspective to decide this is a reasonable thing for them to do. (does anyone ever do this?) 

That last point deserves some special attention...

I remember when I came to the "pay to speedup foundry builds" super early in Warframe, and all I could think was... "seriously? we're now doing iOS Dungeon Keeper Microtransactions garbage?"  I almost quit right there, but I decided to just ignore that mechanic and see what happens, and I'm glad I did, because I played another 700 hours after that. I  spent money on slots and colors, but I have *never* paid to speed up a foundry build, and I don't think many others players have either. 

In my opinion, no game should have *consumable* microtransactions. Sell us all the durable virtual goods you want... Colors. Frames. Weapons. Slots. Feature Unlocks. Etc. But get rid of the idiotic consumable "foundry speedup for real money". Most people are smart enough either to never use it, or to quit the game.. and if they are not smart enough, they will quit the game when they realize they were tricked by the developer into spending real money on something totally pointless and unnecessary. It sends the wrong message. It scares people away. And it's entirely unnecessary. 

 

 

Keep in mind many of us use speed up in foundry to have equal to 00 end of our plat balance

Just because its there does not mean any1 needs to use it but there are some that would want to

Also some players cant afford to buy plat or prime access so all they have is plat they make by selling in game items they acquire
Would you wish them to be locked out of a way to get new prime junk they just get from relics way faster?
I mean like for many of that players you would make plat less valuable by removing rushing craft timers by spending plat
 

As for new players i think problem is only in information
I will agree warframe lacks any PROPER info on what is good and how to mod but lets face it what game you played last time like mmo game where you didnt need to use wiki or youtube to understand something?

On top of that many of that weapons are just MR fodder you would want to stall players progression when everyone want to get high MR fast?
Logic?

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i saw that guy's review and agree to most part then saw his 100 hours to enjoy video. that guy didn't even use another warframe. forget about next 100 hours, he didn't even do the 10 hour basic for finding another warframe to play. the gameplay changes with different frames. the starter 3 may or may not be a good playstyle for new players but there 40+ different variation to choose from, which they might like if they try.

 

about the rushing foundry part. lot of people uses it, most late game players skip 3 days wait for warframe. i personally dont use it since i'm not dying in 2 days or some sh-t.

 

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34 minutes ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

So what almost turned you down was the pay to rush not the waiting? What difference does it make to you if you're willing to wait no issues but you're bothered by the option to rush it?

Yes. Because if a game is going to charge me money for consumables (not durable goods) I'm never going to do it (against my gaming religion), and if that is a core part of the game (which I'd expect when it is introduced so early), then I'll just quit before I waste any more time on that game. 

I firmly believe that introducing consumable microtransactions early in the game is sending the wrong message about what the game is and what monetization players need to stomach to enjoy it. If presenting the option doesn't cause them to quit, a player who is actually fooled into spending $20-40 on foundry speedups early is going to feel really dumb when they realize how the game actually works.

The only thing long-term players have to buy to enjoy the game is slots, and they will eventually buy colors for fun. Short-term players who are going to burn out quick and just want some fun might buy some frames or weapons. 

Would you wish them to be locked out of a way to get new prime junk they just get from relics way faster?

If Foundry plat-to-finish mechanics opened later (at MR10?), and let advanced players spend plat they earn on speedups, it wouldn't matter to me, as I would have already been either hooked or gone from the game by then.

However, I fail to see how someone who is farming prime relics, who has spent hundreds of hours playing the game over months, is going to care about waiting 24-72 hours for something.

I played for 700 hours, and I farmed 8? prime frames, and a bunch of prime weapons. I think I might have bought one prime frame. Maybe? Never bought prime access or foundry speedup. I don't see the sense it in. What is the point of paying money to play the game *less*? If one really wants to play the game less, it's cheaper to just quit.

I bought slots and colors, and a couple vanity items, because they actually make playing the game more fun.

 

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48 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

Yes. Because if a game is going to charge me money for consumables (not durable goods) I'm never going to do it (against my gaming religion), and if that is a core part of the game (which I'd expect when it is introduced so early), then I'll just quit before I waste any more time on that game. 

So this is wrong and against the gaming rules for anyone to do since you do not believe in it.

 

48 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

I bought slots and colors, and a couple vanity items, because they actually make playing the game more fun

But this is ok for you to do, even if no one else cares to do or wants to.

 

So to sum things up you want people to only be able to play WF and spend their money the way you wish them to play it.

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Every person I’ve known that has started warframe, was infuriated but how slow early progression was. A lot of them hate 12 hour build times, let alone 24 and 3 and a half days.

Personally I think you’re very wrong, and what the early game experience would benefit more from is having more weapons you can buy directly from the market for credits with no build time.

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40 minutes ago, minininja77 said:

So this is wrong and against the gaming rules for anyone to do since you do not believe in it.

But this is ok for you to do, even if no one else cares to do or wants to.

So to sum things up you want people to only be able to play WF and spend their money the way you wish them to play it.

Summed up IMO with the same old tired argument that the pedantic, control-based, intolerant players always fall back to using - "play my way or you are doing it wrong".

So many players here act like the plat that other players spend is always coming out of teh rent money or something.

How about all the posters that get mad at others for having the audacity to give DE money just sit down and be quiet?

How about that?

Why do these pedantic gamers think that every person that starts this game is some 12 y/o with no life experience in this attempt to nanny-state the game (made for adults) into an even easier hand-holding experience just because some people have no self control?

2 hours ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

In my opinion, no game should have *consumable* microtransactions. Sell us all the durable virtual goods you want... Colors. Frames. Weapons. Slots. Feature Unlocks. Etc. But get rid of the idiotic consumable "foundry speedup for real money". Most people are smart enough either to never use it, or to quit the game.. and if they are not smart enough, they will quit the game when they realize they were tricked by the developer into spending real money on something totally pointless and unnecessary. It sends the wrong message. It scares people away. And it's entirely unnecessary. 

And that's all this is ... your opinion.

Just because YOU don't have the resources to give DE for convenience, just because YOU have deluded yourself into thinking it is a 'trick', does not make it fact.

It is not pointless or necessary to YOU, but YOU do not get to dictate what other people value.

You are even implying anyone that pays for these things is 'not smart' - uh, I acquired the resources to be able to give DE money for these things and still pay all my bills and stuff, so where exactly am I, or anyone in the same situation, 'not smart', when I am giving the people that make  a game I like more resources to make more game?

Just because some people cannot afford a thing, does not mean those that can are 'lesser humans'.

Can you afford a Lamborghini? I can't, but I don't consider those that can as 'not as smart' as me.

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2 hours ago, (XBOX)C11H22O11 said:

If you watched the last devstream you should know there's going to be something like that

You'd also know that what was shown isn't really the same thing, lol. There's gonna be a little box with some text next to your credit/plat balance that tells you to do the next thing, but as far as they've shown that's it. Not quite the level of guiding that the NPE probably needs. Steve did say something about how it was complicated but I don't see why it would be unless there's more to that system they didn't elaborate on.

2 hours ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

1. Make a new massively simpler "guided Navigation" feature that opens over the star-chart, which presents the player with 3 *visibly giant* mission card buttons that are progression appropriate, show a picture of the faction, a clear label of the mission type, and the *reason* the player is doing the mission. This is conceptually similar to the mission-alerts in the upper-right, but the idea is to actually HIDE/defer/replace the actual star-chart.. so players don't have to handle the huge paradox-of-choice it presents. Instead, they will just see three mission offers. 

Is that level of restriction necessary, though? There are a few areas where blocking the player's progression makes sense but that'd be better handled by improved questing and world-building IMO.

For example, you reach the first branch on Earth after completing the three missions in Vor's Prize, and the game lets you go right up the northern path straight to Cetus which is obviously a bad idea. PoE is a noob-trap and has no business being approached so soon, same with Fortuna. There's a good spot in the starchart progression I think at the end of Neptune where you have to go back to Earth to fight Vay Hek, which requires reaching MR5. Coming back to Earth and meeting Vay Hek would be a great place to properly introduce players to Cetus. But years back when first showing that content they made sure to tell us that our friends who don't play would be able to get there within an hour, so it's kinda stuck in a weird spot. New players shouldn't be there, it doesn't make sense for them to be there, and it's probably detrimental to the experience for them to be there, but it was something DE wanted to appeal to.

New players should be pushed down the southern path towards Venus, something which could be done by taking Cetus off the main path like Fortuna and Deimos are and putting in a "Vor's Blockade" node that prevents you from going that direction. You've broken the Ascaris and are out of mortal danger, but Vor is still hunting you. There ought to be that story and world-building to push you around the Starchart, but players should still be allowed to play the different missions they find - as long as it's not taking them off the critical path.

2 hours ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

3. Push the Foundry and Market unlocks to the 2nd planet. Issue all the MK1 weapons either in the starting quest, or as drops on the starting planet, and make them not take weapon slots (so the player can get them without the Market). After the player makes it to Venus, introduce the Foundry first (to craft a weapon), and the Market (to buy a weapon slot with "free starter plat")

Crafting is a core part of the game and a core part of DE's monetization, so I don't think this is going anywhere. DE wants players to go into their Foundry and make things and they want players to go to the market and buy items. It's why crafting is pushed so hard in the NPE and why DE's recently experimented on it.

Making MK1 items not take slots is interesting, alternatively they could add slots as rewards for the various quests, junctions, and MR ranks as the player works around the map. That'd be a little more valuable, since once the player is done with their MK1 weapons they can have more slots for other things they craft.

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Can people stop with this white box crap? I like my sight how it is.

I don't understand why you're bringing up that one dudes review. But im pretty sure the reason people quit warframe early is lack of tutorials not all the choices or this paradox crap. Hell i quit warframe initially cause the mid system waa confusing to me, then came back when some friends explained it to me.

And delaying the plat market till the 2nd planet is a dumb decision, having the market right there at the beginning helps players see what type of FTP warframe is from what is offered and how much it is. And well it makes the game money, this is a ftp people don't have much attachment to go on cause playing the game is free so there a big chance of player dropping the game for anything to artstyle or not like the starting characters. 

And removing the foundry rush is dumb, ftp gotta make money welcome to the harsh truth. And you are right that people don't spend money to rush, we spend other peoples money from trade market plat cayse im not waiting 3 days for the new prime I grinded for 5 hours straight i want what i farmed now 

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1 hour ago, Zimzala said:

Summed up IMO with the same old tired argument that the pedantic, control-based, intolerant players always fall back to using - "play my way or you are doing it wrong".

So many players here act like the plat that other players spend is always coming out of teh rent money or something.

How about all the posters that get mad at others for having the audacity to give DE money just sit down and be quiet?

How about that?

Why do these pedantic gamers think that every person that starts this game is some 12 y/o with no life experience in this attempt to nanny-state the game (made for adults) into an even easier hand-holding experience just because some people have no self control?

And that's all this is ... your opinion.

Just because YOU don't have the resources to give DE for convenience, just because YOU have deluded yourself into thinking it is a 'trick', does not make it fact.

It is not pointless or necessary to YOU, but YOU do not get to dictate what other people value.

You are even implying anyone that pays for these things is 'not smart' - uh, I acquired the resources to be able to give DE money for these things and still pay all my bills and stuff, so where exactly am I, or anyone in the same situation, 'not smart', when I am giving the people that make  a game I like more resources to make more game?

Just because some people cannot afford a thing, does not mean those that can are 'lesser humans'.

Can you afford a Lamborghini? I can't, but I don't consider those that can as 'not as smart' as me.

Say it louder for those in the back.

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3 hours ago, minininja77 said:

So this is wrong and against the gaming rules for anyone to do since you do not believe in it.

No. You are completely misunderstanding. Keep them in the game, I don't care. I'm advocating pushing them later. 

I'm just saying that if it was my game, I would not want even a single player to quit early because they thought Warframe was about in your face constant consumable microtransactions, which many consider evil, because it's not. 

I am saying that Warframe putting consumable microtransactions in front of the player in the first 5 hours of gameplay just might be *Sending the wrong message* about Warframe's monetization, and that message may turn off people that otherwise would keep playing the game. 

It almost caused me to quit, because IMO consumable microtransactions are usually used in evil ways, and I have unlimited money to spend on games. I spent a bunch of money on Warframe, because it was great fun. ($600?) Much of it sitting in plat I've never found a reason to spend.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

No. You are completely misunderstanding.

I am saying that Warframe putting consumable microtransactions in front of the player in the first 5 hours of gameplay is *Sending the wrong message* about Warframe's monetization, and that message may turn off people that otherwise would keep playing the game. 

I think it's possible that there are players who see that Foundry speedup-for-cash, and think, "hell no" and quit right there. I almost did. That would be a shame, because this is not a core part of Warframe's monetization. I played for 700 hours and never payed for any consumable microtransactions. If you said that to me when I first saw that foundry platinum-speedup, i would have not believed it. 

I don't care if foundry speedup for platinum stays in the game.. I just don't think it should be thrown in front of the user so quickly, giving them the wrong impression.

And BTW, this has nothing to do with giving DE money, or being able to afford gaming. I'm a comfortable retried entreprentur. I can spend whatever I want on games. I spent a bunch of money on Warframe. ($600?) But in my world (and for many in the real world) consumable microtransactions are actually evil. Like real evil. 

Ngl, I did have the first thought thinking warframe was p2w when I first started playing in 2017 on a previous account and dropped it. You'd be right in saying that the market being open to everyone right out the gate sends a wrong message...until you start actually paying attention. When I tried the game again on another account, I realized everything could be earned ingame, without money. The foundry thing is irrelevant to me, I dont mind waiting for my stuff to build, but it's not anywhere near as predatory as you seem to think...because it's an option. You dont HAVE to rush things. Its stuff like that and forma that make DE money. What your presented is literally only a problem if someone doesn't pay attention. Whether it appears right out the gate or 10 hours later, it doesnt matter, at all. Nobody is being forced to use it, nor are people forced to rush the foundry. Why does it matter if it's there anyway? It's not your money being spent, It's not your patience being tested, and you arent the only one playing this game. This really feels like your mad about a problem you made up in your head. A problem that's not even really a problem if it's been working since 2013.

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2 minutes ago, (PSN)ErydisTheLucario said:

This really feels like your mad about a problem you made up in your head. A problem that's not even really a problem if it's been working since 2013.

Why do you think someone posting a suggestion for improving Warframe is mad?

Another endgame thread surfaced a bunch of stats from Steam that suggests Warframe loses the majority of new players in the first 10 hours. That seems like a problem. 

My post is a list of suggestions that I think might keep some of those new player in the game long enough to love the game.

Your reply really feels like you're mad someone has ideas about improving Warframe, like the current game is some kind of gospel. You can rest easy that DE probably won't do most of these things anyway, but I don't see why you get so ruffled about someone making suggestions. 

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Yeah, I think DE has a better idea about what new players do than some youtuber or forum theorizer. DE has actual data. DE has people they pay specifically to look at that data. You're not going to come up with a genius solution sitting behind your computer after playing for a few hours. 

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10 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

Why do you think someone posting a suggestion for improving Warframe is mad?

Another endgame thread surfaced a bunch of stats from Steam that suggests Warframe loses the majority of new players in the first 10 hours. That seems like a problem. 

My post is a list of suggestions that I think might keep some of those new player in the game long enough to love the game.

Your reply really feels like you're mad someone has ideas about improving Warframe, like the current game is some kind of gospel. You can rest easy that DE probably won't do most of these things anyway, but I don't see why you get so ruffled about someone making suggestions. 

None of what you came up with is an improvement. Sorry. If my thought out reply and personal experience makes you think I'm mad, then you clearly are just against everyone who so much as argues against you.

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7 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Yeah, I think DE has a better idea about what new players do than some youtuber or forum theorizer. DE has actual data. DE has people they pay specifically to look at that data. You're not going to come up with a genius solution sitting behind your computer after playing for a few hours. 

That's a very condescending remark. I do have some questions for you though: Why do you think DE has needed to rework the New Player Experience? Why do you think they are still actively trying to improve it? Could it be the paid people with access to the data missed some factors detracting from the New Player Experience? Do you think "some youtuber" providing his personal New Player Experience can't possibly touch on subjects DE missed, that other new players also experienced? Do you think a "forum theorizer" can't possibly touch on subjects that DE overlooked?

Don't be so quick to dismiss topics of conversation, or points of view, simply based on the fact that the people who bring up the topics aren't employed by DE. Dismiss the topics on their merit. Offer alternate points of view.

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8 minutes ago, Silligoose said:

That's a very condescending remark. I do have some questions for you though: Why do you think DE has needed to rework the New Player Experience? Why do you think they are still actively trying to improve it? Could it be the paid people with access to the data missed some factors detracting from the New Player Experience? Do you think "some youtuber" providing his personal New Player Experience can't possibly touch on subjects DE missed, that other new players also experienced? Do you think a "forum theorizer" can't possibly touch on subjects that DE overlooked?

Don't be so quick to dismiss topics of conversation, or points of view, simply based on the fact that the people who bring up the topics aren't employed by DE. Dismiss the topics on their merit. Offer alternate points of view.

It's actually not. Some people find reasons to be offended or victimize themselves for reasons that are a separate topic I guess. 

This is a public forum with thousands of individuals' ideas being flooded onto it without much scrutiny or forethought sometimes, and not all are gonna be feasible or even realistic. 

Like the other guy said, it was obvious the ash rework came from loads of feedback threads, but DEs data and their own rules will only let them do so much, which is why ash got some things people asked for, and many things people wanted they did not get because it was obvious it was never gonna happen. 

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59 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

No. You are completely misunderstanding. Keep them in the game, I don't care. I'm advocating pushing them later. 

I'm just saying that if it was my game, I would not want even a single player to quit early because they thought Warframe was about in your face constant consumable microtransactions, which many consider evil, because it's not. 

I am saying that Warframe putting consumable microtransactions in front of the player in the first 5 hours of gameplay just might be *Sending the wrong message* about Warframe's monetization, and that message may turn off people that otherwise would keep playing the game. 

It almost caused me to quit, because IMO consumable microtransactions are usually used in evil ways, and I have unlimited money to spend on games. I spent a bunch of money on Warframe, because it was great fun. ($600?) Much of it sitting in plat I've never found a reason to spend.

 

 

WF, must be your first and only free to play game I take it? If its not I am guessing you are just vomiting back the garbage from that talking mouth piece off youtube that has like 10min worth of playtime with the game, F2P games survive off micro transactions and at least WF does not lock weapons or characters behind paywalls that can only be attained with premium currency.

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31 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Yeah, I think DE has a better idea about what new players do than some youtuber or forum theorizer.

Uh huh, and what are they doing with that data? Trying to improve the NPE, just like OP. It's the people who keep naysaying any and every time the NPE gets brought up that need to get in touch with reality, not the people who trying to come up with solutions to the same problems DE is actively trying to solve.

16 minutes ago, Silligoose said:

Dismiss the topics on their merit. Offer alternate points of view.

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42 minutes ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

that suggests Warframe loses the majority of new players in the first 10 hours. That seems like a problem. 

Jeez i wonder how many of those players were people bored and tried warframe cause it was free and dropped it cause it wasn't what they were looking for? If warframe was a 60$ game sure people dropping off after so and so hours be concerning but this is a free to play with no restrictions to hop on and play. Hell most free to play games probably have the same thing happening, you're not going to hook everyone who tries the game. Stop using this as a point it's as flawed as using achievements stats to track playerbase 

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1 hour ago, PublikDomain said:

Uh huh, and what are they doing with that data? Trying to improve the NPE, just like OP. It's the people who keep naysaying any and every time the NPE gets brought up that need to get in touch with reality, not the people who trying to come up with solutions to the same problems DE is actively trying to solve.

I'm sure DE has several advanced ideas they're working on when they can.

 

Edited by Hypernaut1
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14 hours ago, xX-Kuro-Xx said:

If you watch video reviews,

Found your problem, mate.

People who spent more times in warframe discussions, moreover youtube videos will be trapped in a mindset that warframe is full of flaws, and in desperate need of some fixes.

While people who spent more times playing the game, sure they bump into couple of annoyances, but they google the solutions and carry on like it never happened.

 

I agree with 90% that hayes said. Except for the part where games need to be interesting from the get go. That's triple-A mindset. Warframe is not a triple-A, and holding out a good content can be a good thing. Check out SkillUp's review about Second Dream

In the end, (1) yes warframe have a lot of flaws. (2) be hopeful, but don't hold your breath about em getting fixed. (3) stay off from warframe youtubers, you'll magically feel better.

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