Wukong Revisit

[Nonso.A]

Wukong Clone isn't attacking atimes especially certain enemies even when marked

 

[Pia92]

After the excellent Wukong rework (imo) the one thing that bugs me is that after Cloud Walker ends, you are left with no momentum, you drop straight down and if you are not ending Cloud Walker 5-10 meters above ground, then you are just standing still. Therefore I think that it breaks the flow and should be reconsidered.

My suggestion is to preserve Wukong's momentum after Cloud Walker ends (keep the same Cloud Walker forwards speed or release Wukong at standard running speed). That way the flow before and after using Cloud Walker could feel tighter and less out of place.

This is my thoughts about Cloud Walker and I'm happy to see what you think about the flow of this ability. Thank you.

I made this proposal into a graph to better show the flow issue and proposed fix.

Edited June 27, 2019 by Pia92
Added the graph

[Drachnyn]

That would be a serious improvement to his speedframe abilities. I like it.

[.Fire_Fly.]

I really would like wukongs cloud walker to also be able to run through small objects like crates the tiny stuff you get stuck on is so annoying

[NinjaZeku]

A similar thing happens on e.g. Slash Dash, if you end it in the air you just drop down,
and are even likely to trigger a hard landing even if you only fell a meter or so.

Also of course fix the whole Sprint toggling off when using Cloud Walker / Defy plskthx.

[Nhaga]

Edit : Sorry I don't know how the forum works when merging topics but my post was originally a response to someone that found instances for which wuclone didn't attack.

I've noticed these kind of problems too and would like to add another quite frequent case for which Wuclone wont attack : 

Wuclone seems quite fond of slightly elevated structures. When in melee mode, if he is standing on a higher ground he will get stuck and will not get down or attack ennemies even if they are marked, attacking the player or attacking the clone (hereafter is a screenshot of the described scenario).

I'm really enjoying most of the changes to Wukong so far so I hope we'll see a little bit more polishing before the devs move on to the next one.

 

Edited June 27, 2019 by Nhaga

[kyori]

Yes it should make you automatically make a bullet-jump when cloud walker ends.

[(PSN)Vexx757]

Here are some suggestions for some improvements for Wisp and Wukong`s abilities;

 

Wisp:

1st ability:

·       When picking up wisps, make them visually translucent by the wisp`s energy colour looking like there are invisible, doing this will make it visually less annoying to look at.

·       The electric mote that’s left behind should be able to shock enemies when approaching it.

 

2nd ability:

·       The decoy should be able to bypass obstacles, grates, enemies and any object that looks like you could squeeze through it. (fence)

·       Teleporting should refresh her glide time, bullet and double jump.

·       If you jump in the air and cast it, it synergises with the passive by make it invisible so you can reach the other side without being detected by enemies in its path.

 

3rd ability:

·       If an effected enemy receives a status proc from your weapon, the surge sparks should carry over the status proc to nearby enemies that they also can be affected by it.

·       Enemy killed should deal bonus damage to the nearest enemy with surge sparks.

·       Increase the chance of releasing surge sparks to 20%.

 

4th ability:

·       Make there be an option to aim while using it.

·       Make it leave behind a fiery trail for 10 seconds.

 

From playing Wukong`s new reworked kit, it`s a big improvement. I glad that some ideas I had for him has been added to wukong;

·       Wukong having the ability to use clones. (which most ppl wanted)

·       The clone’s survivability is based on wukong`s health shields and armour plus power strength.

·       The damage the clones can do to enemies will depend on power strength and melee mods.

·       (Synergy) You can increase the clone’s survivability by using the 2nd ability before you cast the 1st ability

·       Make it able to go through lasers, door barriers. (it won`t set off alarms)

·       Wukong does a wide range attack affecting enemies.

 

This is all well and good but I have more suggestion and feedback to add to him;

 

1st ability:

·       Wukong should spawn two clones, one using primary weapon and the other secondary weapon. When you switch weapons, one of the clones will switch to melee.

-        Wukong constantly switching from gun to melee affects the clone’s performance which is a problem.

 

·        Since you have two clones, you can mark up to two enemies for each of them to attack.

·        After marking the enemy, the clone(s) should teleport to the target.

-        When marking while the clone is using a melee weapon, the clone takes a long time to reach the target. If using guns, it`s stuck in a spot and can`t kill the target because of obstacles in the way.

 

·       Clones can use whatever stance you have in your melee weapon and stance from the 4th ability.

·       When you crouch the clone will crouch and not attack enemies unless you mark them.

·       When using melee, the clone`s sprint speed is increased by 30%

-        I noticed that the clone is better at using guns than a melee weapon.

 

·        Instead of the clone teleporting to you when you move far from it, pressing the ability on the ground will teleport the clone to that location.

-        In defence missions you want the clone to attack enemies but if you move far from it, it teleports to you which is something you don`t want.

 

2nd ability:

·       Holding the left trigger (controller) should give the option to decrease it`s speed. Doing so will also increase the duration of use.

·       If the clone attacks an enemy affected by the stun of the 2nd ability, the clone should perform a finisher, doing so will make the clone invulnerable until animation is done.

·       Sentinels and companions are invulnerable while activated.

·       This ability should be able to travel through grates and any object that looks like you could squeeze through it. (fence)

EDIT: After duration runs out keep it at the sprint speed you have it on instead of disabling it to slower sprint speed.

 

4th ability:

·       The second part of the combo with the kick animation should (small) ragdoll the enemy hit instead of a knockdown.

·       The ground slam animation should look like the slams when Wukong`s staff is bigger. (the slam we have now looks weak)

·       The ground finisher animation should be Wukong jabbing his staff into the enemy`s back.

 

Primal fury is way better than it was before however it’s just a stronger staff with a different stance, it doesn`t have a unique ability like Excal and Valkyre.

 

Here so some options for some unique abilities;

·       It has the ability to charge it. Holding the attack button at an enemy will pull wukong to it causing a kick that staggers the enemy and closing the gap.

·       While blocking, wukong can absorb dame with no limit and can be released by a slide attack, a slam attack and synergises with the 3rd ability by increasing the swipe damage.

·       While using it, Wukong has 30% increase dodge speed, bullet-jump 50% farther and 20% sprint speed.

·       While blocking, wukong can reflect damage back at enemies having a 20% chance of staggering them.

 

Fix: When Wukong stans still with no weapons equipped, the animation is meant to show him with the staff in his hand but you can`t see.

Seriously you give him a rework but you didn`t even notice this? It has been like this ever since he was released, are we going to wait another 4 year for you to fix this? Come on get your head together and get to it... please.

Edited June 28, 2019 by (PS4)Vexx757

[febehco]

I feel the same way but I dont know... The whole Cloud Walker thing is about Wukong takin his Iron Staff and stretchin it to go into the clouds, just like Power Pole from Dragon Ball, when it runs off he takes the Iron Staff and shortens it to get to the ground. So in that sense it would make no sense to keep the momentum, plus you can always bullet jump after it rans out and you can pretty much spam the move. Its already OP as it is.

[LuckyCharm]

Cant say i ever really managed to use his taunt very well, seems like its duration is a little too short, given how sonme enemies just miss a whole lot, or stop shooting to move etc, but my real desire for change would be to give cloudwalker 1-2 more seconds base. Currently it just really doesnt feel long enough to get to cover in some cases

[vFlitz]

5 hours ago, Pia92 said:

After the excellent Wukong rework (imo) the one thing that bugs me is that after Cloud Walker ends, you are left with no momentum, you drop straight down and if you are not ending Cloud Walker 5-10 meters above ground, then you are just standing still. Therefore I think that it breaks the flow and should be reconsidered.

Hold right click when Cloud Walker is close to ending and you'll enter an aim glide immediately when it does, then you can either roll to gain some momentum or recast without losing any altitude

[(PSN)CommanderC2121]

A question for you Mr. Monkey. As someone who didnt play wukong too much (although Im loving his reworked form), I remember his old ult staff growing with combo counter, is that corrrect? And if so, is that still a thing? I ask because I swear at time my staff (the energy bits) are longer then when I first start, and I know for sure my clones staff grows in length because it can cover the whole room at times, even if he still finds the need to get in kissing range to melee. 

[(PSN)CommanderC2121]

1 hour ago, LuckyCharm said:

Cant say i ever really managed to use his taunt very well, seems like its duration is a little too short, given how sonme enemies just miss a whole lot, or stop shooting to move etc, but my real desire for change would be to give cloudwalker 1-2 more seconds base. Currently it just really doesnt feel long enough to get to cover in some cases

I found its nice to use enemy dropped damage pools (like nox gas clouds, corrosive moa pools, napalm fireballs) to charge your 3 after casting it. You dont always get full charge but you can get half or more most of the time 

[DeMonkey]

2 minutes ago, (PS4)CommanderC2121 said:

A question for you Mr. Monkey. As someone who didnt play wukong too much (although Im loving his reworked form), I remember his old ult staff growing with combo counter, is that corrrect? And if so, is that still a thing? I ask because I swear at time my staff (the energy bits) are longer then when I first start, and I know for sure my clones staff grows in length because it can cover the whole room at times, even if he still finds the need to get in kissing range to melee. 

It no longer does, but yes it did used to.

There is a visual glitch where you can make the staff extend to the moon, as seen on page 3 or something of the thread. Simply perform the first attack in the closing combo and that's it. No follow up.

[LuckyCharm]

6 hours ago, (PS4)CommanderC2121 said:

I found its nice to use enemy dropped damage pools (like nox gas clouds, corrosive moa pools, napalm fireballs) to charge your 3 after casting it. You dont always get full charge but you can get half or more most of the time 

❤️ great idea, thanks mate ill give it a shot

[Kierlak]

Cloud effect is far too in the way. Can't see anything. First time I used the ability I instantly wondered how that made it live.

[(NSW)Eclectics]

The new Wukong is lots of fun! I hope we find out whether Wukong Prime is coming soon or not, because I am hesitant to use Forma if that's right around the corner. 

[grogxz]

I like the new Wukong.

One suggestion: Leaving Cloud Walker shouldn't toggle running back to walking mode because this disrupts the fluidness of motion.

 

[Xepthrichros]

10 hours ago, (NSW)Eclectics said:

The new Wukong is lots of fun! I hope we find out whether Wukong Prime is coming soon or not, because I am hesitant to use Forma if that's right around the corner. 

Wukong prime "preview" can be seen on reddit already. 

Should be arriving July 7, after Equinox Prime Access ends. 

Edited June 29, 2019 by Xepthrichros

[TheBrandenRose]

Wukong is now actually awesome to play. His former abilities kind of turned me off from playing the frame.

The only problem I have is his 4th ability switches off for me randomly, even when he still has energy, and I have to press 4 twice to activate Primal Fury again. Dunno what that's about. 

Edited June 30, 2019 by TheBrandenRose

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

A suggestion for Wukong Twin's weapon selection

if I equip a Rifle and Pistol (no melee), Twin should use whichever of the two I am currently not using. ATM he just always uses Rifle even if I'm wielding it.

if I am Dual-Wielding a Pistol with Glaive, Twin should use my Rifle. ATM he uses the Glaive.

 

Admittedly, Space Magic, so there's no reason he can't be Cloning my weapons.... But I dunno; I'd rather see him use whatever I'm not currently wielding

might allow for some more interesting Loadouts that way since now all equipped weapons will be utilized...

 

[DeMonkey]

1 hour ago, (PS4)haphazardlynamed said:

A suggestion for Wukong Twin's weapon selection

if I equip a Rifle and Pistol (no melee), Twin should use whichever of the two I am currently not using. ATM he just always uses Rifle even if I'm wielding it.

if I am Dual-Wielding a Pistol with Glaive, Twin should use my Rifle. ATM he uses the Glaive.

 

Admittedly, Space Magic, so there's no reason he can't be Cloning my weapons.... But I dunno; I'd rather see him use whatever I'm not currently wielding

might allow for some more interesting Loadouts that way since now all equipped weapons will be utilized...

 

I'd rather hope we get the ability to force usage via some as yet unimplemented means, so that you can have that whilst those who want it to use the same weapon as ourselves can also have what they want.

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

20 minutes ago, DeMonkey said:

I'd rather hope we get the ability to force usage via some as yet unimplemented means, so that you can have that whilst those who want it to use the same weapon as ourselves can also have what they want.

Well, the way the ability is currently described; he's meant to do melee when you're ranged and vice-versa; and he swaps them realtime as you do.

Dunno if that was chosen for Lore or Balance reasons or how compelled DE is to maintain that theme....

 

I wouldn't mind that entire feature removed and simply have him permanently wield whatever weapon you currently have selected On Ability Cast; the way Equinox Duality works.

 

 

..my guess is DE has him using the opposite of player is for balance; they're trying to discourage double DPS, tho that control is easily bypassed and maybe ought to go.

Everywhere I see players bring Wukong with only 1 weapon equipped to force him to use it....

[vFlitz]

7 hours ago, (PS4)haphazardlynamed said:

.my guess is DE has him using the opposite of player is for balance; they're trying to discourage double DPS, tho that control is easily bypassed and maybe ought to go.

Everywhere I see players bring Wukong with only 1 weapon equipped to force him to use it....

It wouldn't be as much of an issue if he wasn't absolutely horrible with melee and if we had more control over what we're holding ourselves (like, not getting switched to a gun every time we want to do a mucking glide)

But yeah, we should just have all the options. Limiting player choice like that and making us jump through hoops to get what we want doesn't tend to work well - especially when combos between different weapons is the ability's main appeal. Detracting from the synergy aspect of the clone only pushes him more towards afk/passive source of damage role, which I don't believe is DE's end goal either.

[DeMonkey]

15 hours ago, vFlitz said:

making us jump through hoops to get what we want

That's pretty much what this feels like.

Want your clone to actually use a weapon effectively? Then you have to unequip your melee weapon. Pointless hoop that's basically a loophole.

Want to still get the Glad set effect for when you use Primal Fury, without a melee weapon equipped? Gotta use Helios and Deconstructor. Pointless hoop that's also basically a loophole.

Want to give it a Zakti or whatever the status pistol thing is whilst you use a CO melee weapon? Gotta unequip your Primary weapon. Pointless pointless loophoophole.

I can see the design intent, clone uses whatever you're not using so that as a pair you cover both CQB and ranged combat, however when people are frankly just abusing loopholes in the system because the design leads to poor performance it's probably worth changing the design.

Edited July 1, 2019 by DeMonkey