Yareli is not the worst Warframe in the game (spoiler alert: it's Caliban)

[(PSN)Hopper_Orouk]

I'm joking, of course, they're both equally terrible, poorly thought out and designed, but there is something so magical about 2021 that happened at Warframe to release 2 of the worst warframes in the game back to back, Yareli in update 30 and Caliban in update 31 the new War.

but I wanted to grab your attention to Caliban because Yareli is more famous and known as the worst.

First of all, Caliban was pretty much dead on arrival, the insanely frustrating farm that's tied to the new veil proxima, and Narmer bounties, plus he was tied to one of the most anticipated story quests, made everyone pretty much forget he exists.

but that's not all, dear reader, Caliban is Worse than Yareli not only because he has useless abilities, it's clear he had 0 effort put in making him.

I don't mind having weak Warframes, i mean after all, Warframes aren't made by the same group of developers every single time...or are they?

let's briefly discuss his abilities: 

Passive: Adaptation free trial edition, capped at only 50% (which is ok fine, it's a passive), doesn't trigger on damage over time status effects, doesn't even act like how Sentients actually adapt!

and why is it shared among players? is Caliban a support? 

Razor Gyre: If you google forum threads about Razor gyre, chances are you're going to find one of mine, begging DE to fix it's bugs, and they STILL haven't fixed it completely.

deals immense amounts of pure ZERO damage, has a synergy with sentient wrath THAT LITERALLY DOESN'T WORK, can't pick up orbs nor loot, and orbs and loot STILL BLOCK SOME OF THE DAMAGE despite DE saying they fixed that bug in the patch notes, expends insane amount of energy for no good outcome, it's his worst ability.

Sentient Wrath: Tied to one of the worst crowd control effects ever created in this decade (Lifted status) 

Lethal progeny: You know, for a caster Warframe that has 150 energy at max, they sure thought it's a good idea to have to spend 150 energy to get all three sentients, that lasts for very poor duration, do very poor damage, and can easily die. Logic 9000

Fusion strike: You thought i was going to say it's his best ability right? I guess any ability that has token armor strips is automatically labeled the best, sadly Fusion strike is the WORST armor strips in the game.

first of all you're going to cast a lot of it and it's his fourth ability, so you'll keep spending 100 energy all the time, on top of 150 energy of his third ability, with a frame that has only 150 energy, again, Logic 9000

And all that when Xaku can strip armor and shields in an area of effect and it lasts indefinitely. and Nyx strips armor and shields in her second ability, and only needs extra 25% strength.

 

Caliban is the Worst Warframe in the game.

 

[Raarsi]

5 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Caliban is the Worst Warframe in the game.

Hydroid would like a word.

[sunderthefirmament]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Caliban is the Worst Warframe in the game.

He definitely needs some changes.  He has one of the worst abilities in the game (Razor Gyre).  There's no defending it.  It's completely useless.  But Caliban isn't the worst frame in the game, not when Hydroid (irrelevant), Atlas (statstick melee can't save 3/4 terrible abilities), and Limbo (grief frame with increasingly irrelevant CC) exist.

 

Caliban's defense strip is what earned him a place in my regular roster.  It covers an area, persists for a while, strips permanently, and doesn't take that massive of an investment to hit full strip.  It also can't be nullified, and that's why I use him for sortie/incursion disruptions.  I will fully agree that Xaku is a better frame, but Xaku's defense strip is a bit fraught.  You need a target, and it can get nullified.  Furthermore, there are enemies that Caliban can strip, that Xaku simply can't.  Angels, unless I'm very much mistaken, are an example.

 

His kit has problems, but I've still found some use for him.  I do wish he'd get the changes he needs, but devoting the time and resources needed to polish unpopular frames isn't exactly something DE is known for.

[cute_moth.npc]

Honestly except for her K-Drive still needing control refinements and bug fixes, I think Yareli is pretty nice? ^^;

She's one of my favourite Warframes now.

Caliban to me is not even interesting enough to actually go get.

[Tiltskillet]

Are you not up to date on the Yareli boosts, Hopper?

Personally I'd say inaros is the worst by a wide margin.  Caliban's below average, but I'm not sure if he's bottom 5.  He's inordinately frustrating though since there are several obvious things wrong with him and he's received close to zero attention.  And unlike Inaros it's not like DE has the excuse of Cali being popular despite those shortcomings.

[Rathalio]

Yareli is pretty strong now that she got fixed and a few QoL.

Also yeah... you forget hydroid exists sir. And Inaros being good at only one thing, carrying a lot of health, and even that is still debatable.

Then, I understand and respect most of your critiques about Caliban, but your argument about energy feels a bit silly though? When you reach the point you can get Caliban you have access to primed flow don't you?

Although I played him for a bit and his Batalyst didn't feel bad in terms of duration. At least definitely not as bad as playing Trinity with all her crap base durations on her abilities. And sentient wrath felt ok to me as well as it synergies well with the saxum set mods. His passive is silly when you know adaptation doesn't stack with it, but it's just a passive at the end, if it was stacking I would be quite strong for a passive I think. And yeah his razor gyre is just a meme... sentients do the spin so does Caliban...

[-Krism-]

1 hour ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

I'm joking, of course, they're both equally terrible

Maybe Yareli is just not your type of gameplay; since her buffs, she got pretty damn strong & fun to play

Also, Hydroid is the worst, not Caliban

Edited April 15, 2023 by -Krism-

[(XBOX)Lord ChibiVR]

There are a few frames I'd say contend for the worst alongside Caliban:

Inaros: not a bad frame per say, but his entire thing (tanking) won't scale indefinitely while another frame (Revenant) can. On top of that several other frames can also tank just as well as Inaros in almost every situation outside of endless missions. 

Loki: not that bad but similarly to Inaros is in the situation where other frames (Octavia and Wisp) basically do everything he's good at but better. 

Equinox: definitely can be good but was seriously hit hard with the addition of eximus 2.0. She is very high investment as she has the worst energy economy out of any frame by having two channeling abilities. Her role as a supportive dps/healer is vastly overshadowed by other frames, and two of her best helminth combinations (gloom and parasitic armor) were both nerfed a ton which combined with multiple abilities failing to be cast on eximus heavily damaged her survivability.

 

Edited April 15, 2023 by (XBOX)Upl0rdYT

[Almxce]

Caliban isn't a bad warframe - just subsume Razor Gyre for something else lol. He's good at crowd control, couple that with his armour strip and you have a frame that plays pretty nicely and can hold his own while providing support in the form of CC/Armor strip. His summons damage isn't bad (use Sentient Wrath to debuff enemies) but their primary use isn't for damage as they can replenish shields/grant overshields and provide another source of CC as well. He works fine with a playstyle that pretty involved but that might not be everyone's cup of tea.

[trst]

Imagine thinking free DR, a damage amp, shield gating synergy, and 100% AOE armor stripping is bad,

Also I suggest stepping off  the Yareli hate train meme. We get it, you hate K-Drives now get over yourself. But if you actually tried the frame since their last round of buffs you'd find that they're far stronger than the memes suggest. Even her K-Drive is strong just for how OP its augment is.

 

If you want to talk about the actual "worst" frame then we'd be looking at Hydroid who has nothing going for them other than a farming augment. Bad damage types, clunky and slow abilities, a joke passive, and already had a failed rework.

[Rathalio]

19 minutes ago, (XBOX)Upl0rdYT said:

Loki: not that bad but similarly to Inaros is in the situation where other frames (Octavia and Wisp) basically do everything he's good at but better. 

Equinox: definitely can be good but was seriously hit hard with the addition of eximus 2.0. She is very high investment as she has the worst energy economy out of any frame by having two channeling abilities. Her role as a supportive dps/healer is vastly overshadowed by other frames, and two of her best helminth combinations (gloom and parasitic armor) were both nerfed a ton which combined with multiple abilities failing to be cast on eximus heavily damaged her survivability.

Loki definitely outside of spy missions only has his invisibility being relevant in your gameplay which is cries for some help and a revamp of his kit.

Equinox though, I've been recently enjoying her quite a lot, she requires a lot of gear to be at her full potential and be comfortable in steel path missions for sure and it definitely not very accessible (casting speed shards & strength shards help a lot). But she has quite a few options and works very well when you give her some love. Also I believe gloom & parasitic armor would be the worst helminth for her tbh x) If you want gloom, go with a bit of strength in her build and the augment of her 3 ability in night form (which btw also reduce enemy damage as well as slowing them). And parasitic armor I don't really what do you want to do with it. And for the economy just run primed continuity + fleeting expertise you will be fine really, I don't even run with flow with that combo. Although something I do not appreciate with her, is her 4th ability augment, tbh this should be built-in and not use a mod slot or be an exilus at least. This is just basic utility and it's a bit silly to have to be forced to use it if you want to play with her duality augment.

Edited April 15, 2023 by Rathalio

[Tyreaus]

26 minutes ago, (XBOX)Upl0rdYT said:

Equinox: definitely can be good but was seriously hit hard with the addition of eximus 2.0. She is very high investment as she has the worst energy economy out of any frame by having two channeling abilities. Her role as a supportive dps/healer is vastly overshadowed by other frames, and two of her best helminth combinations (gloom and parasitic armor) were both nerfed a ton which combined with multiple abilities failing to be cast on eximus heavily damaged her survivability.

FWIW, I've found Silence over her 3 to be surprisingly effective for her survivability, making her able to get into Steel Path with only a bit of Adaptation and Arcane Blessing _{or whichever grants health on orb pickup.} The stun and Eximus nullification, coupled with Resting other targets and regaining shields / shield gates via Mend, helps a ton. Maybe not Steel Path endurance level survivability, but not a pushover either, and since it isn't a channeled ability, ends up pretty cheap to upkeep.

(You could probably do better if you paired the stun on Silence with the slow on augmented 3, but I haven't gone and tried that myself.)

The bigger problem I ran into at that level was making use of Maim. Amour resists it so hard that I just gave up on using it. And, of course, my personal pet peeve is, and forever will be, that she's the pinnacle of botched thematics. Her entire shtick is transitioning between two forms, so lets make it cost as much as humanly possible to dissuade players from doing so. Costs energy, costs time, costs an ability slot (compare Limbo), and costs any charges built up unless you have an augment (and Peaceful Provocation kicks the bucket even with that augment IIRC). I think the only other speedbump left unused is making the game hard-crash to desktop.

[sunderthefirmament]

3 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

The bigger problem I ran into at that level was making use of Maim. Amour resists it so hard that I just gave up on using it. And, of course, my personal pet peeve is, and forever will be, that she's the pinnacle of botched thematics. Her entire shtick is transitioning between two forms, so lets make it cost as much as humanly possible to dissuade players from doing so. Costs energy, costs time, costs an ability slot (compare Limbo), and costs any charges built up unless you have an augment (and Peaceful Provocation kicks the bucket even with that augment IIRC). I think the only other speedbump left unused is making the game hard-crash to desktop.

Although you're not asking for advice, I found the following suggestion helpful enough to breathe life into my Equinox for Steel Path use when I had long ago set her aside.  Consider using Terrify.  It doesn't need that much strength to hit full strip.  It can be a little annoying when enemies run away, but they can't run very far if they're dead from a juicy Maim explosion.

 

That said, I do agree that Equinox, as much as I like her, really missed the mark on her theme.  It's a nightmare to build for both forms and switch between them, so I tend to forget that Night exists.  Also, a lot of her abilities are just stupidly convoluted or have obnoxious restrictions applied to them.

 

...Kind of like Caliban, to get back to the original topic.  Why do his minions bodyblock us?  Why is his kit filled with annoying ragdoll effects?  Why hasn't DE fixed it so that his 4's aura is visible to clients 100% of the time?  Why has Razor Gyre been allowed to exist as it is?

[(XBOX)C11H22O11]

Inaros has terrible abilities, his only use is the high health which isn't even good outside the regular nodes

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

Subjectively speaking, he's probably my least favourite Warframe. I'm just not really a fan. Not sure I consider him the weakest though, I am just not a fan of the gameplay loop to get the most out of him. I'd definitely not accuse him of lacking zero effort behind him though. I'd sooner accuse the sentiment of such an accusation of having zero effort behind it, just because words on a forum are so cheap and easy than what goes into the creative processes resulting in actual character. 

So I agree with some of the points made, and think they are well reasoned, but not all nor necessarily the conclusion. In a way I would almost consider it good for the game, that not all Warframes are equally as compelling, I've seen some a few dedicated Caliban, and Yareli fans. I've seen a lot of people who dislike Lavos and Mag and wish they would change, even though I really like them as they are.  If I had to guess the Warframe, most people want changes/improvements to, its probably Hydroid. I see such sentiment from as many people who do like Hydroid as they currently are, but still want better, as those who are more critical from an outsiders perspective. 

[gamingchair1121]

dude.

yareli is top tier.

how do you even think she's bad

2 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

caliban has useless abilities

funny spin ability, cc and damage vulnerability, free and easy shield gating, aoe lingering defense strip... those are all useless? ok...

 

also I have a potato and four forma, challenge accepted

[(XBOX)Lord ChibiVR]

1 hour ago, Rathalio said:

 Also I believe gloom & parasitic armor would be the worst helminth for her tbh x) If you want gloom, go with a bit of strength in her build and the augment of her 3 ability in night form (which btw also reduce enemy damage as well as slowing them). And parasitic armor I don't really what do you want to do with it. 

For gloom, using it with her 3 used to effectively make everything frozen, and is less strength intensive compared to normal gloom setups. It still works except eximus fight back.

Parasitic armor prior to Citrine's last wish would give you instant shield gates, as all additive shield from abilities/mods) would instantly convert to overshields, meaning it was useful on Equinox/Styanax for survivability because every kill = 1.3 seconds of immunity. It also worked with Equinox's 2.

However, DE caught on to the fact you could basically spam super cheap abilities on frames like Khora or Atlas and run around killing things with your 1 or 2 while being completely untouchable and nerfed it so augur mods don't work with parasitic armor. From what I gathered from people talking about it, no shields can be gained anymore while parasitic armor is active.

46 minutes ago, Tyreaus said:

FWIW, I've found Silence over her 3 to be surprisingly effective for her survivability, making her able to get into Steel Path with only a bit of Adaptation and Arcane Blessing _{or whichever grants health on orb pickup.} The stun and Eximus nullification, coupled with Resting other targets and regaining shields / shield gates via Mend, helps a ton. Maybe not Steel Path endurance level survivability, but not a pushover either, and since it isn't a channeled ability, ends up pretty cheap to upkeep.

(You could probably do better if you paired the stun on Silence with the slow on augmented 3, but I haven't gone and tried that myself.)

The bigger problem I ran into at that level was making use of Maim. Amour resists it so hard that I just gave up on using it. And, of course, my personal pet peeve is, and forever will be, that she's the pinnacle of botched thematics. Her entire shtick is transitioning between two forms, so lets make it cost as much as humanly possible to dissuade players from doing so. Costs energy, costs time, costs an ability slot (compare Limbo), and costs any charges built up unless you have an augment (and Peaceful Provocation kicks the bucket even with that augment IIRC). I think the only other speedbump left unused is making the game hard-crash to desktop.

I agree with this. I also absolutely forgot about the fact she requires multiple augments just for her abilities to be useful.

Edited April 15, 2023 by (XBOX)Upl0rdYT

[sunderthefirmament]

4 minutes ago, gamingchair1121 said:

dude.

yareli is top tier.

how do you even think she's bad

Merulina is wildly unsuited for the tilesets we have in the game.  Let me just head off your claims of "but if you invest the time to master it" with a "it's not worth it, and it's really, really, really buggy."

 

5 minutes ago, gamingchair1121 said:

funny spin ability, cc and damage vulnerability, free and easy shield gating, aoe lingering defense strip... those are all useless? ok...

Speaking of Merulina, I would argue that Merulina is tied with Caliban's "funny spin ability" for worst ability in the game.  The tanking benefits and speed/utility that Merulina can provide come at a massive cost: reduced weapons, transition time, energy, clunky mobility, and glitches.  Razor Gyre does negligible damage and leaves you exposed.  It could generate energy instead of costing it, and it would still be his best Helminth slot, and it's not even close.

 

I like Caliban.  And I think that Yareli has come a long way.  But Razor Gyre and Merulina are equally embarrassing abilities that DE should really address.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

2 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Caliban is the Worst Warframe in the game.

eh, I disagree. he's not the best, far from it, but Yareli is a dose of pure does of unfiltered raw cringe whenever she appears, Caliban doesn't elicit any negative emotional reactions out of me whatsoever. K-Drives also make my skin crawl, so a cringe frame with a K-Drive is cringe²

2 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Razor Gyre:

Razor Gyre does suck, a version of Battalyst's death lasers would've been better, but I guess Revenant already does that. the only other Sentient ability I can think of that would be worth a damn would be a Symbilist-style riot shield, which as a first ability wouldn't be too bad IMO, especially if you could still have it up when using his 4, so you can laser things while protected, just like a Symbilist does.

2 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Sentient Wrath: Tied to one of the worst crowd control effects ever created in this decade (Lifted status) 

from what I've seen people say lifted mainly sucks because it makes headshots more difficult, maybe if enemies were just frozen in place instead it'd be better (and less like Rhino Stomp). Lifted Status was supposed to be helpful for melee combat vs tough units mostly, because you don't have to worry about being gunned down or melee'd yourself before you can start getting your combos in. anyway, lifted status is another discussion entirely, we're here to talk about Caliban.

2 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Lethal progeny:

it is costly yes, but for me the real crime is that ALL of the units are basic conculysts, when really you want active friendlies to be doing ranged attacks: even Atlas' Rumblers, which are by no means the best summons in the game at all, can throw rocks, whereas tougher enemies may destroy Conculysts before they can close in with their spinnign attacks. a cooler version IMO is to make each one a progressively stronger Sentient unit, so that then it's worht the energy cost, and you can use as little or as much support as you want., it would work like this:

- the first summon is the Conculyst, who actively seeks out and aggressively attacks enemies in melee. he's just there to draw a little agro and watch your back, not much more.

- the second summon is a Battalyst; clearly you need some kind of ranged support as well, so a Battalyst turns up and immediately upon spawning performs the Death laser move, before proceeding to float around and shoot enemies with it's cannons.

- the thirds summon is a Symbilist; you called up all 3 of the Progeny now, so obviously something big is going down and you need the whole crew: whilst the others do their thign, a large Symbilist will act as your bodyguard, protecting you from enemy fire with it's shield and vaporizing anyone who gets too close to you with it's powerful sweeping laserbeam. 

this will make the player feel more like a Sentient summoner, whcih is what Caliban clearly attempts to be, so he should have access to stronger Sentient units as well.

2 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Fusion strike:

probably won't get touched anyway as it strips armor, personally I think it's fine, and it's fun to use a massive beam. if you want another example of a lacklustre beam, I'd say Wisp's Sol Gate: that doesn't even strip armor at all, and it's literally channeling the power of a star..

anyway, Caliban will likely get a rework at some point, just like Yareli did, so I wouldn't fret too much about his current kit.

 

[quxier]

4 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

2021 that happened at Warframe to release 2 of the worst warframes in the game back to back, Yareli in update 30 and Caliban in update 31 the new War.

Around that time were covid. Some companies were not having "good time" during that time (e.g. they cannot do motion capture). Then they went "full on RJ" updates during that time.

This gave us 3 bad frames: Yareli, Caliban & Sevagoth. Yareli at least get some changes & fixes. Caliban & Sev get very little.

4 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

 

first of all you're going to cast a lot of it and it's his fourth ability, so you'll keep spending 100 energy all the time, on top of 150 energy of his third ability, with a frame that has only 150 energy, again, Logic 9000

And all that when Xaku can strip armor and shields in an area of effect and it lasts indefinitely. and Nyx strips armor and shields in her second ability, and only needs extra 25% strength.

Styanax' armor stripper is very good. I've not tested but playing with that ability on Xaku I can armor strip lot of enemies, even below me (it's not in front of you armor strip, it has some "3d" stuffs... hard to explain).

4 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Fusion strike: You thought i was going to say it's his best ability right? I guess any ability that has token armor strips is automatically labeled the best, sadly Fusion strike is the WORST armor strips in the game.

I wonder if it's the worst. I feel like Hildryn is worse. Fusion strike while slow lasts for some time (so new enemies can enter). Hildryn's require 300 or 400 strength, and it's very slow to recast.

4 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

Razor Gyre: If you google forum threads about Razor gyre, chances are you're going to find one of mine, begging DE to fix it's bugs, and they STILL haven't fixed it completely.

deals immense amounts of pure ZERO damage, has a synergy with sentient wrath THAT LITERALLY DOESN'T WORK

It probably works but keep in mind that both abilities are very weak. It was long time ago ( so take it with grain of salt) but with something like 200-300% strength, Sentient wrath has buff that you can see.

I've posted about this as well (old topic):

 

4 hours ago, (PSN)Hopper_Orouk said:

 

Passive: Adaptation free trial edition, capped at only 50% (which is ok fine, it's a passive), doesn't trigger on damage over time status effects, doesn't even act like how Sentients actually adapt!

and why is it shared among players? is Caliban a support? 

Sharing (is caring) is not bad thing. However 50% is like... not visible for higher levels. When you have Adaptation you basically don't have passive.

4 hours ago, sunderthefirmament said:

He definitely needs some changes.  He has one of the worst abilities in the game (Razor Gyre).  There's no defending it.  It's completely useless.  But Caliban isn't the worst frame in the game, not when Hydroid (irrelevant)

3 hours ago, -Krism- said:

Also, Hydroid is the worst, not Caliban

4 hours ago, Raarsi said:

Hydroid would like a word.

Hydroid can boost your loot (4th), can soft/hard cc (1st or 4th) and its passive doesn't disappear.

I've not been playing it but it has augments for status immunity and healing (even for allies).

3 hours ago, Rathalio said:

Then, I understand and respect most of your critiques about Caliban, but your argument about energy feels a bit silly though? When you reach the point you can get Caliban you have access to primed flow don't you?

That doesn't mean you can just throw 150 energy for almost nothing. Because for some CC/damage and very rarely shield you spent 150 where you can for example armor strip enemies for N seconds.

3 hours ago, trst said:

Imagine thinking free DR, a damage amp, shield gating synergy is bad,

2 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

damage vulnerability and easy shield gating... those are all useless? ok...

Damage boost of 2nd is very small. Just cast 4th to armor strip. There might be some synergy with lifted status (school, mods etc) but I'm not sure if it's worth it with potentially flying enemies.

Free DR is very small. For that level (narmer bounties) you won't even notice it. And it doesn't work with Adaptation (no faster stacks gain or something).

Shield gain is very inconsistent. When I've been testing it I may get very small amount of shield then Sentients go somewhere taking shield regen.

2 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

cc

I'm not sure if it's anything good.

2 hours ago, gamingchair1121 said:

funny spin ability

Yeah, it's funny (and I had little bit fun with it) but it's basically useless. 2nd don't buff it enough and throw enemies around (no control over it). Using 4th requires you to deactivate it, which isn't fun. Read mentioned topic for my suggestion.

[CosoMalvadoNG]

3 hours ago, -Krism- said:

Also, Hydroid is the worst, not Caliban

I was trying to make it at least somewhat playable with helminth but in SP it's the most pathetic and useless thing ever... Hydoid at least has its niches, some are decent in certain situations and have good survivability but caliban is useless at almost everything he does.

1 ability: meh! low damage and turns you into a spinning target...
2 ability: the most decent thing you have but with fatal limitations; maximum number of enemies and wave slow expansion.
3 ability: meh! extra targets that when they are not fighting heal your shield when with a simple mod you do the same job simply by using other abilities and at any time.
4 ability: Blast damage why? an ability with decent damage but only does slightly more damage to machines and fossilized armor.

Edited April 16, 2023 by CosoMalvadoNG

[KitMeHarder]

IMO it's a three-way race between Caliban, Nyx, and Hydroid for the worst frame in the game (and Hydroid relies on his augments to not be a definitive last.). Most other frames mentioned in this thread don't even get close to how bad these 3 are.

• No reliable damaging ability (there's plenty of room for utility frames in this game, but these 3 ain't it).
• 99% of the time their individual abilities (and even their wholistic kits) are done better by other frames.
• They're not even frames that are good and "only" have merit in endurance, like Citrine, Ash, etc...
• There's a difference between usable and good. I have a Caliban build that does just fine in SP (kuva survival)... Does he do it better than any other frame? Nope. Does he even have a (worthwhile) unique trait to make up for the lower performance (i.e Desecrate)? No... Everything in this game is usable... doesn't mean you should use it.

[LordOfThePovos]

Ok I hear you but check this out:

Caliban is a warframe that is made out of sentient parts designed to resemble a sentient, some might even call him an imposter sentient...

A lot of people who were aggrieved by Caliban's lack of playability versus effort to acquire normally feel the need to vent about it...  

The fact that Digital Extremes seems to have "forgotten" this warframe while at the same time he was pulling low sales is suspicious some might say...

Looking at all this data and points made so far point to the fact that something more devious is at play and I am calling an emergency meeting to discuss any hidden meaning to it...

 need I say anymore?

[Tiltskillet]

1 minute ago, quxier said:

I wonder if it's the worst. I feel like Hildryn is worse.

If you mean as a pure defense strip, yeah, Pillage is arguably worse.  But as an overall ability, Pillage is pretty amazing with its shield restore and status cleanse on top of a defense strip.   (Not to mention it's nearly indispensable in Hildryn's overall kit.)

Fusion Strike is good, but it would be a truly great ability with fewer bugs and  some ancillary effects.  For instance, if its vortex actually worked.

[(PSN)thowed]

Why does Atlas always get left out of these discussions?  Id rather play Hydroid or Yarelli any day than run around hoping my power punch kills the strong enemies while my armor drains faster than a water bottle with a hole at the bottom.