Umbra warframes [Discussion & Appreciation][*spoilers*]

[(PSN)Daikon177]

12 hours ago, Famecans said:

Hype:

• New Umbra and Sacrifial Polarity.
• Mag Umbra with special ability.
• New Rifle with special ability.
• [Redrection Umbral]; [Stretch Umbral]; [Streamline Umbral].
• [Metal Auger Sacrificial]; [Split Chamber Sacrificial].

What about sacrifical rifle crit mods since we have primed shred (punch though) and galvanized chamber already?

[(PSN)Galbrant]

I would love to see Mag Umbra and Volt Umbra. Maybe release those two on the 10th Anniversary. And then every 5 years release a new Umbra.  But yeah it would be nice not to have to recast everything on Excalibur Umbra. 

[(PSN)Sentiel]

I was hoping to get Umbra frame based on my selection at the begining of the game, so Volt Umbra for me, and I would absolutely LOVE it since Volt is my most used frame to this day.

[Birdframe_Prime]

23 hours ago, Famecans said:

• [Redrection Umbral]; [Stretch Umbral]; [Streamline Umbral].

Ehhhhh... I genuinely have to ask 'but why?' on Redirection...

Shields have no benefit for being larger. There are only three frames that benefit from having a high Shield pool in any way, and all of them have some reasons why not going into too much shields is fine.

Believe it or not, Valkyr benefits from having high shields. She shouldn't, because the ability that benefits only benefits from the most tiny piece of damage boosting. But she does benefit.

Harrow benefits from having a high shield because the first cast of his 2 creates the Duration from how much Shields he sacrificed. Except that he doesn't need massive shields because he can easily go into Overshields for 2400 points of shield without any mods, and because recasting his 2 will add to the Duration up to a cap of 90 Seconds. So you don't need a high Shield value to play Harrow either.

And the last is, of course, Hildryn. Her Shield is her Energy Pool, which is an oddly interesting concept. The thing there is that she also has the literal strongest Shield Generation ability in the game with her 2 and even with the Augment for her 1. Building for Strength is so strong on Hildryn that she can literally ignore all Efficiency and just regen Shields so well that she'll never even fall out of her 1200 Overshields (where she's also immune to Toxin bypassing her Shields). A Redirection is good to get her going, but in all honesty she doesn't need anything more.

What makes Shields in any way strong is the Shield Gating mechanic, which is currently still nice and exploitable. But even if DE fix things like the Dragon Key reducing Shields to low enough that players can exploit near-infinite Shield Gating, it's still the main draw of how Shields work.

You gain no benefits on any frame for building in more shields once you are beyond level 15 Enemies.

Stretch, Streamline, great picks, ability affecting mods.

But a better one for casters would be Umbral Talent, or Umbral Siphon, maybe Umbral Respite (Umbral Auras? Why not?)

[Famecans]

48 minutes ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

Ehhhhh... I genuinely have to ask 'but why?' on Redirection...

Shields have no benefit for being larger. There are only three frames that benefit from having a high Shield pool in any way, and all of them have some reasons why not going into too much shields is fine.

Believe it or not, Valkyr benefits from having high shields. She shouldn't, because the ability that benefits only benefits from the most tiny piece of damage boosting. But she does benefit.

Harrow benefits from having a high shield because the first cast of his 2 creates the Duration from how much Shields he sacrificed. Except that he doesn't need massive shields because he can easily go into Overshields for 2400 points of shield without any mods, and because recasting his 2 will add to the Duration up to a cap of 90 Seconds. So you don't need a high Shield value to play Harrow either.

And the last is, of course, Hildryn. Her Shield is her Energy Pool, which is an oddly interesting concept. The thing there is that she also has the literal strongest Shield Generation ability in the game with her 2 and even with the Augment for her 1. Building for Strength is so strong on Hildryn that she can literally ignore all Efficiency and just regen Shields so well that she'll never even fall out of her 1200 Overshields (where she's also immune to Toxin bypassing her Shields). A Redirection is good to get her going, but in all honesty she doesn't need anything more.

What makes Shields in any way strong is the Shield Gating mechanic, which is currently still nice and exploitable. But even if DE fix things like the Dragon Key reducing Shields to low enough that players can exploit near-infinite Shield Gating, it's still the main draw of how Shields work.

You gain no benefits on any frame for building in more shields once you are beyond level 15 Enemies.

Stretch, Streamline, great picks, ability affecting mods.

It's really useless for most frames so I just predict that DE will try to keep the Shield theme for Mag.
rhino and frost can get benefit from temporary parasite armor but I would love for DE to improve shield mechanics and shieldgating for any build.

 

48 minutes ago, Birdframe_Prime said:

Umbral Talent

hey that's sounds pretty good

[Birdframe_Prime]

On 2022-01-19 at 12:57 AM, Famecans said:

hey that's sounds pretty good

Thanks ^^ Let's say they come with something like Ember (another caster, but I have a Latin name for Ember that can match with Excal Umbra; Cinis) 

How about these stats on the new three:

Cinis Streamline, base 30%, levels to 40% and 60% with Set Bonus.

Cinis Stretch, base 45%, levels to 60% and 90% with Set Bonus.

Cinis Talent, base 50%, levels to 60% and 80% with Set Bonus.

The reason for the base stats being identical to the regular stats is similar to the reasoning for Umbral Vitality and Fibre being the same at base, where the extra point cost is for the Tau Resistance, but the set bonus...

Putting them at the same allows the maths of the stacking Set bonus to basically give us a Corrupted mod for both Range and Efficiency without any drawback. (We would then be able to slot Boreal's Hatred for a full 175% Efficiency, too.)

While Casting Speed is not considered an Essential by many, using only three mods on a Caster to achieve the same stats as two Corrupted mods would be... fun ^^

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

kind of an update generally bringing in what we know or how it's been viewed 

also some concepts for the devs and food for thought to be helpful

2022 : SO far ... (frames, tenno)

at this time, we know warframes are created from humans (not sure if only humans) , using a virus (technocyte darksectors link) via the helmith to infect a target host and then that makes them into frames after a grueling period of transformation, and they went and turned on the orokin who then locked them away.(some volunteered, some did not) 

Warframes after this retain their minds and emotions per ballas via the vitruvian, it was only after tenno were discovered that tenno could calm/control (mentally neuter) and make them usable weapons, this was done while tenno slept as they could wireless transfer while in an unconscious state, and the orokin used this as a way to pair up compatible tenno and frames for combat use. it also might be the case that tenno were mentally controlled/manipulated as during the lotus erra scene the tenno seemed under some sort of influence and used by lotus to be effective orokin tools. 

 the children of zarimon made a deal with wally who seems to have used the eververse concept to do... something that granted the tenno void powers 

Umbra : excalibur variant

at this time the only Umbra frame is Excalibur umbra, who using a single burning memory was able to keep his sense of self 

the prior info we know from ballas is that frames usually retained sense of self regardless, so its possible this is meaning the sense of self and memory while the body is used for transference aka another person piloting them .

(this is conjecture) 

another thought is this is due to the making of an umbra frame virus is possible different and we know it has differences in function and setup. The foundry as we know it is a mass 3d printer that can even generate clones of frames or modified frames, if a given BP and BP parts are provided 

similar to how excalibur prime was likely modified to generate the normal Excalibur variant, it's possible umbra strain was a modified variant, and the memory was used to prevent the original excalibur mental state from overlapping and keeping the umbras state soley the umbra mind, possibly for the umbra hosts experience/knowledge, ballas was not expecting this to work

Eververse possible development use: 

 we already know per the devs more umbra frames are coming (eventually), this series variant is to start with excalibur then progress, the devs have also stated this is to not be lore related story wise 

So, if umbra exists per probability, then variants on each timeline/reality can be different, then we could in theory use the void /duviri as a way to traverse these and gain new umbra variants. i.e. maybe in one universe its Umbra frost or nyx or ember, ect and we have to earn the bps and rebuild the clone in our reality and tame them?

the eververse really opens the door for the expansion of the system and giving players a new methodology to obtain and build them 

Echos of umbra: 

this was a concept brought up then shelved (due to uber grind and worthless time limit) 

basis was that you would gain echos from lua and place them on any frame of choice to then grant that frame the umbra ai specter ability, problem was it didn't last long and was a pain to grind. thus, the devs shelved and will bring it back in a different way.

imo : the devs could use echos of umbra as a resource to use to locate umbra variants in the eververse "hunts" as prior stated to act as compasses to find realities with different umbras for players to hunt and gather, more than likely defeat them and then get parts /resources ect  , the umbra specter ai could be built st6ill using echos as a resource for a Mental awareness addon to any frame, however I'd suggest this be a toggleable system in the loadout for each frame as sometimes you don't want a ai specter getting shot while you're fighting say an eidolon . 

personally, I would just make it like toggle ai on/off same as we do with prime parts but have in in the frames mod loadout so abc could be setup with it in mind or not

[ChaoticEdge]

it would be crazy if the paradox Dariviur has umbra frames.  Man imagine the hoard of them....then again umbra we know today for he was toss out like chop left over meat for he didn't get involved with the story.

Spoiler

Umbra do nothing with the new war quest.  Bit of big ouch for umbra...

 

Edited March 1, 2022 by ChaoticEdge

[Numerikuu]

1 hour ago, ChaoticEdge said:

it would be crazy if the paradox Dariviur has umbra frames.  Man imagine the hoard of them....then again umbra we know today for he was toss out like chop left over meat for he didn't get involved with the story.

  Hide contents

Umbra do nothing with the new war quest.  Bit of big ouch for umbra...

 

He did though (if you chose him). He fought the sentients along with you and helped you reach and save spacemom.

The only reason he didn't act on his own when confronting Ballas--which a LOT of people seem to have forgotten--is that Ballas was his Maker. At the end of The Sacrifice he literally paralyses Umbra and prevents him and the Tenno from acting due to the special transference bolt/link they have. That's why the Tenno has to literally eject themselves to finish stabbing him, because Ballas's transference on Umbra is stronger than theirs.

Back on topic though, would love to see more Umbra frames in the future if they're not just slapped in willy nilly and presented in a similar fashion to Excal Umbra or even Harrow (kinda sad Harrow didn't get an Umbra tbh, he would be perfect for one imo, same for Nidus).

Edited March 1, 2022 by Numerikuu

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

On 2022-03-01 at 3:17 PM, Numerikuu said:

He did though (if you chose him). He fought the sentients along with you and helped you reach and save spacemom.

The only reason he didn't act on his own when confronting Ballas--which a LOT of people seem to have forgotten--is that Ballas was his Maker. At the end of The Sacrifice he literally paralyses Umbra and prevents him and the Tenno from acting due to the special transference bolt/link they have. That's why the Tenno has to literally eject themselves to finish stabbing him, because Ballas's transference on Umbra is stronger than theirs.

Back on topic though, would love to see more Umbra frames in the future if they're not just slapped in willy nilly and presented in a similar fashion to Excal Umbra or even Harrow (kinda sad Harrow didn't get an Umbra tbh, he would be perfect for one imo, same for Nidus).

 

i played as umbra on xbox an as baruuk on pc , same setup occurs , kind of lack luster

at end of sacrifice though with operator in control umbra GUTS ballas so i dont think thats a reason as we the operator allow umbra to take his revenge in a way as it was a near fatal blow (reason ballas goes half sentient was to save his life)

 

there has been a lot of theories on what frames can get an umbra, and de did originally state it was limited number, but they have never repeated that, just simply the frames following excalibur umbra will be umbra frames iirc. this concept of using the void nexus and duviri seemed the most logical way to implement them and even open the floor for new addition mission types ect to earn umbras was my thinking

[(XBOX)EternalDrk Mako]

On 2022-03-01 at 2:02 PM, ChaoticEdge said:

it would be crazy if the paradox Dariviur has umbra frames.  Man imagine the hoard of them....then again umbra we know today for he was toss out like chop left over meat for he didn't get involved with the story.

  Reveal hidden contents

Umbra do nothing with the new war quest.  Bit of big ouch for umbra...

 

i mean even if it dosnt initially i think the potential and loophole that the eververse concept in the void produces an opportunity for de to utilize it in a way thats satisfactory and lets us get new umbra frames 

[UmbraPrime5515]

So with the New War been released for a couple of months now. So Umbra knew Ballas and he was a Dax at some point. I am little confused why [DE] did not add anything with him with the new war. So Umbra never wanted revenge it would of made sense. It would be pretty cool to interact or see he around the orbitor too. His story is amazing almost better than the new war. Do not let Umbra be a one time thing.

Edited March 24, 2022 by UmbraPrime5515

[Leqesai]

DE has a history of doing this sort of thing.

 

[(PSN)Ragology]

I'd rather see umbra versions of the other frames.

 

Like an umbra wisp crying because her feet got cut off.

[Birdframe_Prime]

Yeah, this is exactly the kind of thing that DE do tend to forget.

In terms of the Umbral style of things and frames... DE have said that, if they do something more, it's going to be in a similar weight and importance as they did with Umbra. Other frames will get an Umbral style version, but not all of them, and not soon.

It's on the other side of more updates.

[AmirX3]

there are multiple topics that i would like to discuss ,in my opinion they are imperative to do 

1) Umbra mods :

we have umbra mods that focuses on Armor,Health and strength but what about the other mods that focuses on Range,Efficiency,Shield and Duration and it would be great if we get the full set 

2) Umbra Volt and Mag :

In 2018 Umbra excalibur was in the game during the sacrifice quest and i understand there can't be umbra for everything but would it be possible to make Umbra Volt and Mag, since they were the first warframes to get aside from excalibur 

3) Beyond Steel path :

Don't get me wrong Steel path is hard but what if there's an endgame mode that only experts can finish with interesting rewards 

4) PVP mode :

it's a new game mode which your clan can challenge another clan through maybe railjacks battles and race to get various rewards from it 

[(PSN)ErydisTheLucario]

3 hours ago, AmirX3 said:

there are multiple topics that i would like to discuss ,in my opinion they are imperative to do 

1) Umbra mods :

we have umbra mods that focuses on Armor,Health and strength but what about the other mods that focuses on Range,Efficiency,Shield and Duration and it would be great if we get the full set 

2) Umbra Volt and Mag :

In 2018 Umbra excalibur was in the game during the sacrifice quest and i understand there can't be umbra for everything but would it be possible to make Umbra Volt and Mag, since they were the first warframes to get aside from excalibur 

3) Beyond Steel path :

Don't get me wrong Steel path is hard but what if there's an endgame mode that only experts can finish with interesting rewards 

4) PVP mode :

it's a new game mode which your clan can challenge another clan through maybe railjacks battles and race to get various rewards from it 

1. Likely because of power creep, either way, we don't need more of that imo. Realistically something like that is likely not on the list of priorities for DE.

2. One of those cool ideas that are brought up, as usual, are just that. Ideas. They'll remain as so until its addressed by DE. They're too busy quickly releasing new mediocre frames instead of working on another umbra variant of a frame.

3. This is debatable. In my experience, it's not hard at all. The issue with motivating me to play it is that there are no new rewards. None. After the first few times and getting all the SE for the things I want, it quickly became useless. SP just needs more rewards, but I imagine even the player base and DE know what players really want. And you know what? I'm one of those people. I doubt they could make a mode that people WANT to replay over and over again for mediocre rewards. Something harder than SP isn't gonna happen. DE is still having issues with game balance.

[AmirX3]

29 minutes ago, (PSN)ErydisTheLucario said:

1. Likely because of power creep, either way, we don't need more of that imo. Realistically something like that is likely not on the list of priorities for DE.

2. One of those cool ideas that are brought up, as usual, are just that. Ideas. They'll remain as so until its addressed by DE. They're too busy quickly releasing new mediocre frames instead of working on another umbra variant of a frame.

3. This is debatable. In my experience, it's not hard at all. The issue with motivating me to play it is that there are no new rewards. None. After the first few times and getting all the SE for the things I want, it quickly became useless. SP just needs more rewards, but I imagine even the player base and DE know what players really want. And you know what? I'm one of those people. I doubt they could make a mode that people WANT to replay over and over again for mediocre rewards. Something harder than SP isn't gonna happen. DE is still having issues with game balance.

first i respectively disagree i think SP is hard and they need to do new one that is harder and as for umbra mods ,they have to be full set 

[(PSN)ErydisTheLucario]

10 hours ago, AmirX3 said:

first i respectively disagree i think SP is hard and they need to do new one that is harder and as for umbra mods ,they have to be full set 

Well...sorry to say, but they don't HAVE to do anything. What you want wouldn't be likely to happen anytime soon, if at all. They haven't mentioned umbra frames since the sacrifice, and they didn't mention mods at all. DE can hardly balance the game as it is, and somehow you want it harder with you already saying it's hard enough? That's incredibly unlikely. Same with the mods, they might just remain an idea. Besides, we already have enough mods and arcanes to make us op 10x over. Sorry to say, but some of this is likely not gonna happen. They dont HAVE to make it happen just because one person thinks they need to. That's silly. No matter how they do it, this game is easy. If you want a challenge, Warframe is not that game.

Edited April 10, 2022 by (PSN)ErydisTheLucario

[SpicyDinosaur]

Also, ship races and pew pewing at each other from turrets is not PvP. DE needs to actually put time into Conclave rather than make more dead PvP modes.

[AmirX3]

7 hours ago, (PSN)ErydisTheLucario said:

Well...sorry to say, but they don't HAVE to do anything. What you want wouldn't be likely to happen. They haven't mentioned umbra frames since the sacrifice, and they didn't mention mods at all. DE can hardly balance the game as it is, and somehow you want it harder with you already saying it's hard enough? That's incredibly unlikely. Same with the mods, they might just remain an idea. Besides, we already have enough mods and arcanes to make us op 10x over. Sorry to say, but some of this is likely not gonna happen. They dont HAVE to make it happen just because one person thinks they need to. That's silly. No matter how they do it, this game is easy. If you want a challenge, Warframe is not that game.

Well... sorry to say but i'm not the ONLY one who thinks that and you can think of warframe as an easy game because there's no harder mode than steel path and here's an idea ,what happens if they revealed more umbra mods , are you gonna quit the game ?how about not using umbra mods in the first place if you think you are an expert and don't need them , if they didn't want the game to be broken why we got those mods in the first place ?.....some people need new umbra mods and some don't.....it won't hurt anybody if we got new umbra mods and warframes and whether you like my opinion or not i'm entitled to say my ideas...i'm done here 

[0_The_F00l]

Wouldn't mind more umbra mods honestly as the current set is most useful for more of a tanky build and less effective for others reducing my reason to use umbra mods , 

But i doubt there will be more umbra frames , as there is a very specific reason for umbra to exist.

I would prefer the reduction of the existing powercreep before any "harder" content is made.

And we already had clan vs clan events , they were the darksector wars , and there is a reason why we went into indefinite armistice for it.

[Myscho]

Umbra Excalibur exist because DE wanna stop players beg for Excalibur Prime, so my guess there wont be any more Umbra frames

[(PSN)ErydisTheLucario]

2 hours ago, AmirX3 said:

Well... sorry to say but i'm not the ONLY one who thinks that and you can think of warframe as an easy game because there's no harder mode than steel path and here's an idea ,what happens if they revealed more umbra mods , are you gonna quit the game ?how about not using umbra mods in the first place if you think you are an expert and don't need them , if they didn't want the game to be broken why we got those mods in the first place ?.....some people need new umbra mods and some don't.....it won't hurt anybody if we got new umbra mods and warframes and whether you like my opinion or not i'm entitled to say my ideas...i'm done here 

Who said I was gonna quit? All I said was that this stuff wasn't likely to happen. Sorry you don't wanna hear what someone else has to say. You did come to a public forum. If the mods happen, that's cool, but there's been no mention of it in recent memory. Same thing with the frame. You think I dont want mag umbra? Of course I do, but I'm also aware of DE's tendency to bring something up, and not pursue it for a good while. The mods realistically we dont need, but it wouldn't break things for me. Weird that you would assume that. It wasn't an attempt to be rude, I was just being realistic.

Edited April 10, 2022 by (PSN)ErydisTheLucario

[Galuf]

The main selling point of the frame umbra mods was the Tau resist. I'm unsure about what it does. If you want more stats on your frames just use invigorations.