SPEKTRE76 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 (edited) I have seen quite a number of people has some disdain for using Archwings in a space fight with giant ships one shooting them. What if they gave us Fighters like the enemy has? Would you all be opposed to that? I know we all have our Orbiters but those are too kinda big to be fighters. I'm talking like TIE Fighter or X-Wing sized birds. Fighters that have MOD slots and weapon slots. Maybe your Rail Jack can have a Hangar Module with fighters that you can launch like Specters or fly yourself and board an enemy vessel? Just thoughts. Edited February 16, 2020 by SPEKTRE76 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OniDax Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 8 minutes ago, SPEKTRE76 said: I have seen quite a number of people has some disdain for using Archwings in a space fight with giant ships one shooting them. What if they gave us Fighters like the enemy has? Would you all be opposed to that? I know we all have our Orbiters but those are too kinda big to be fighters. I'm talking like TIE Fighter or X-Wing sized birds. Fighters that have MOD slots and weapon slots. Maybe your Rail Jack can have a Hangar Module with fighters that you can launch like Specters or fly yourself and board an enemy vessel? Just thoughts. I'm all for it but from what I've seen, many players within the community are against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taiiat Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 do a barrel roll. (sure, why not) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)Lollybomb Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Probably wouldn't be a bad idea since they clearly don't want us using Archwings in Railjack. But then why bother having extra guns on the Railjack when people can just go use their fighter? Maybe a link weapons option to have the unused guns fire on the same target as the pilot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Fluffins Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 (edited) I actually like archwing, since I like the idea of having mecha-wings and giant space guns. The problem is that the current implementation is a bit wack, but DE is planning an archwing rework, so maybe they will fix the balance issues then. Instead I would like to see different types of ships in general, like a variant with no slingshot (but some other advantage), or no artillery, or no refinery (so you start at max ammo and everything but cant restock during the mission), no side turrets, or more side turrets, you get the idea. But this would probably be too much work for DE to make and properly balance variant ships. Edited February 16, 2020 by Mr.Fluffins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptainMinty Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 A good fighter implementation would be giving a fighter a significant speed boost at the cost of being weaker in terms of armor and gun damage. But to compensate for the pathetic armor and shields of the ship, Crewships cannot lock on with their cannons. Beef up the might of the Railjack, giving it higher power guns and drop the insane speeds that sucker can reach. Make it a heavier weapons platform, decimating anything with its heavy weaponry. But the fighter's higher speed allows them more mobility and thus greater loot range and effective distractions. Also give the fighter a boarding capability superior to ramsleds. The fighter can breach a hull, then pull out without damage to the fighter itself. Orokin tech. That'll explain how it does that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veridian Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Carrier has arrived. +1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_of_Psi Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 With Arcwing 2.0 coming out, there should be no need hence the "Should" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SordidDreams Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 (edited) Just strap some guns onto the Liset. And make it cloak when you leave it. 5 hours ago, (PS4)Lollybomb said: Probably wouldn't be a bad idea since they clearly don't want us using Archwings in Railjack. Joke's on them, I don't want to use the railjack in railjack, so if they make the fun playstyle non-viable, I'll just ignore the game mode entirely. Edited February 16, 2020 by SordidDreams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackHargreav Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Anything that won't get killed within a mili-second by a crewship is fine by me. Also it would be nice if invisibility would #*!%ing work in Railjack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xyngrr Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Void cloak works fine. If you mean frame invisibility, not sure on that one but didn't have alot of issues with a silent weapon ash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Firetempest Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 (edited) Archwings are getting reworked with the modular system. Soooo. A bit early to add more junk outside the original scope. Let them fix the current equipment. Smaller mid size fighters/bombers should be mini railjacks for solo or duo railjack missions in the future, or as support equipment for something like railjack raids. Edited February 16, 2020 by Firetempest 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)robotwars7 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 7 hours ago, SPEKTRE76 said: Just thoughts. right now, it's not gonna happen, but considering we have modular weapons, Companions and now Archwings are going Modular, I reckon it's only a matter of time that we may see something like this. if Archwing still sucks after the modular changes then I'd say they'll have tried everything at that point and they should just scrap it and replace it with something else, like fighters. it's a cool concept, and modular fighters would be interesting. one way I could see it being implemented sooner is if they give the Railjack a "scout pod" or something: a smaller craft that one of the crew takes out to reach places the Railjack can't go, but it also has it's own weapons. right now though, Archwings do the same thing, so it's unlikely to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)guzmantt1977 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 9 hours ago, SPEKTRE76 said: I have seen quite a number of people has some disdain for using Archwings in a space fight with giant ships one shooting them. What if they gave us Fighters like the enemy has? Would you all be opposed to that? I know we all have our Orbiters but those are too kinda big to be fighters. I'm talking like TIE Fighter or X-Wing sized birds. Fighters that have MOD slots and weapon slots. Maybe your Rail Jack can have a Hangar Module with fighters that you can launch like Specters or fly yourself and board an enemy vessel? Just thoughts. Doesnt make any sense. The complaint that weak archwings are weak, or that some enemy attacks do a lot of damage in a short space of time, doesn't mean that giving us a "tanky/powerful" fighter plane is a solution. Enemies are supposed to be tough to take on. This is not beginner level content. Giving massive doses of powercreep is a pretty good way to imbalance the game in short order. Want to be in a ship that does not die as quickly as your archwing? Stay in the railjack there are a lot of useful roles to perform as support crew. Want to not die as soon as you pop outside? Use a defensive archwing to increase survivability, that comes from being in a clan and having the research done, there are a lot of really good things locked away in those panels and newbs can benefit enormously from joining a clan. Want an archgun that does a bit more damage than your no-forma starter archgun? Try building, modding and adding forma, if you can't fast level it by deploying your weapon during regular combat that's a good hint that you have a long way to go to be ready for the Railjack content. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SordidDreams Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said: Giving massive doses of powercreep is a pretty good way to imbalance the game in short order. You might want to let the designer of the kuva weapons know that, I'm sure he'd appreciate the expert advice. 35 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said: Stay in the railjack there are a lot of useful roles to perform as support crew. Yeah, but not a lot of fun roles. Edited February 16, 2020 by SordidDreams 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Methanoid Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Railjack was supposed to make archwing relevant, instead of what they ended up as, which is an open world taxi service, nothing has changed with archwing just as useless and pointless in railjack. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(PSN)AllOrNothinDays Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 So archwing 2.0 ( rail jack ) to archwing 3.0 where they try to make it better a third time with fighters? Not hating on the idea just got to understand where you are with it at this point. Just makes it already more convoluted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackHargreav Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 6 hours ago, Xyngrr said: Void cloak works fine. If you mean frame invisibility, not sure on that one but didn't have alot of issues with a silent weapon ash. I'm personally thinking about Itzal's invisibility. For whatever reason Crew ships can still one shot you while you're invisible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PookieNumnums Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 Archwing should be the fighters. They shouldn't need more viable replacements. They have existed and been mostly neglected for far too long. Just make them great and eff the bee ess. Like ive said previously. The only logic i can think of as to why arch gear is so pathetic in railjack game mode is so that using the railjack isnt overshadowed and made obsolete. To fix that, as suggested in the op (kinda) we simply need more rj enemy variation. Shield and damage type reworks or more accurately stated revisions, could allow for such a dynamic to exist. A simple and very bare bones example of this is: Standard archwing enemies : dargyns dogmas and drones (or whatever they're called) would have low to moderate armor and be weak to corrosive blast and radiation. These enemies would be dispatched from crewships. And they would be mostly handled by archwing weaponry. These enemies would attack railjacks doing chip dmg but focus on any wingers as priority and really only pose a threat to the jack if totally ignored and allowed to build up in numbers. Standard railjack enemies: exos and intros and gyros (joking but you know what i mean, the two or three fighters we have) would be weak to one or two of the newer elements and statuses introduced with railjack and would be predominantly fought by and concerned with the railjack itself. We would see a reduction in these enemies due to the fleets of lesser arch enemies being dispatched. Perhaps reduced down from 30 60 90 to 20 40 60. Introduce some archwing mods that would add the newer damage types from railjack to arch weapons so that wingers could aid in their destruction. And then biccbois. Crewships and megacrewships that can be attacked by wing weapons but are fairly resistant to it. Railjack would be the primary means of combat. Crewships could be destroyed by pilot and side turrets but new mega crewships must be weakened first ala reactor destruction and disabling shield generators ( basically 1 hack and destroy, one hack and defend ) And once vulnerable turrets deal some dmg but main focus destructive force coming from our beam cannons. This would make combat so much more engaging and require a tiny bit of strategy. Help validate the long standing lack of necessity for arch gear. And add depth to any mission on railjack regardless of objectives and proxima. Thank you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DOOMPATRIOT Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 What about fighters instead of Railjack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Rez090 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 4 hours ago, JackHargreav said: I'm personally thinking about Itzal's invisibility. For whatever reason Crew ships can still one shot you while you're invisible. They know how Itzal works, you have to be stationary for invisibility, so the pilot and gunners keep shooting where you went invisible. They do gather intelligence on what we develop. 16 hours ago, CaptainMinty said: Crewships cannot lock on with their cannons. They don't even have lock on cannons, just very good pilots and gunners. Same as our railjacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aesthier Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I was thinking along similar lines however I thought it might be cool if our landing craft were used as fighters in RJ missions. It wouldn't be hard to attach them to or even house them in the Railjack. It would also give players an extra opportunity to show off the types and skins of the craft they own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corvid Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 8 minutes ago, (XB1)Rez090 said: They don't even have lock on cannons, just very good pilots and gunners. Their primary cannon is a homing repeater (though it doesn't lock on to archwings), and the secondary armaments are a pair of proximity-detonated explosive launchers (which IMO were always the more dangerous of the two for Archwings, even when the main gun could lock on to them). You're overselling the AI's competence here, methinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(XBOX)Rez090 Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 1 minute ago, Corvid said: Their primary cannon is a homing repeater (though it doesn't lock on to archwings), and the secondary armaments are a pair of proximity-detonated explosive launchers (which IMO were always the more dangerous of the two for Archwings, even when the main gun could lock on to them). You're overselling the AI's competence here, methinks. Not really, take over a crew ship from the enemy and try out their weapons for yourself. The pilot gun isn't homing, it has to be aimed just like our rj guns do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
(NSW)Sk0rp1on Posted February 16, 2020 Share Posted February 16, 2020 I’d rather have BIGGER war-frames, like gundam sized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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