For anyone interested in the results of changes to Marked for death instead of just going gaga [updated with videos].

[0_The_F00l]

I read the Patch notes and i was kinda disappointed with the Marked for death changes.

But i make it a point to not make remarks unless i personally test them. (yeah i mostly used ash cause lets be honest on the ones who are the most affected by it)

The following is a Steel path run on Adaro. It is very clear that it is extremely unreliable,

half the time i didn't have enough energy to cast it (can be fixed with build changes) , the remaining time the targets were all with (relative) weak health and so resulted in very little damage (i could do much better with just my melee)

The following are various combination of attempts in the SIM:

so with some time in the sim the following is observed:

1) Core ability itself is still the same (mark enemy -> do damage -> damage spreads)

2) Ability is still limited my LOS (enemy hiding behind 2 inches of terrain? cant hit em)

3) Damage in now capped by 2 additional factors

1. Marked enemy CURRENT health
2. 75% of damage TO HEALTH (achievable by 150% power strength)

it doesn't matter if your finisher damage is capable of 2 billion damage , if the marked enemy has 100 health you can at most do 75 damage but it will still be finisher damage. Enemy has 100 health? do 75 damage to surrounding, enemy in surrounding left with 25 health? now you do 18.75 on next use , enemy left with 6.25 health? now you do 4.6875 and so on. it gives very bad diminishing returns. if you didn't kill everything in the first attack forget about using the ability again, its pointless.

4) It will act as an explosion with the exact same damage type as applied to enemy , including chance to proc status. Finisher (true) will directly hit enemies health , corrosive will do corrosive , viral will do viral, if enemies have varying damage resistances to different damage types it will result in different numbers being represented.

5) There is no chance to do critical damage in the explosion- but if your marked attack was critical and did 3K damage as a yellow crit or orange crit , all enemies will be damaged for 3K as a regular attack.

6) Multi shot does not work , only one of the pellets counts (shotguns and snipers with MS will be less effective)

7) Stealth multipliers do not work.

 

Conclusion:

Moderately disappointed with the changes,

Ability now needs targeting the highest health enemy to be even remotely useful and when it is it is still faster to just kill em with melee.

DE has done a poor job of balancing it and is clear they AGAIN did not really test the abilities before introducing them,

The damage cap based on health should be removed.

 

So while the ability is greatly reduced and you cant see big red numbers - if the damage capping based on max health is removed the ability is still salvageable and effective.

Without it you are better off using regular melee weapons to save time in most scenarios.

What are your views?

[Imniscor]

My view is I got from 1 million to 100k.
Yes, exactly 10 times less damage with Skiajati.

[Tiltskillet]

15 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

But i make it a point to not make remarks unless i personally test them.

I believe this is a violation of forum rules.  /REPORTED

=

[Ikyr0]

You are overthinking it. Take a Fatal Teleport Ash into Steel Path Mot, spend 5 minutes there. The ability is less than garbage. It literally does nothing. It was totally gutted.

I know DE does this kind of nonsense relatively frequently, but it never happened to something that I really enjoyed like MfD. Feelsbadman.

[(XBOX)ECCHO SIERRA]

14 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

A little late for video uploads, maybe i will add them later after i get some sleep.

I read the Patch notes and i was kinda disappointed with the Marked for death changes.

But i make it a point to not make remarks unless i personally test them. (yeah i mostly used ash cause lets be honest on the ones who are the most affected by it)

so with some time in the sim the following is observed:

1) Core ability itself is still the same (mark enemy -> do damage -> damage spreads)

2) Ability is still limited my LOS (enemy hiding behind 2 inches of terrain? cant hit em)

3) Damage in now capped by 2 additional factors

1. Marked enemy max health -
2. 75% of damage TO HEALTH (achievable by 150% power strength)

it doesn't matter if your finisher damage is capable of 2 billion damage , if the marked enemy has 100 health you can at most do 75 damage but it will still be finisher damage.

4) It will act as an explosion with the exact same damage type as applied to enemy , including chance to proc status. Finisher (true) will directly hit enemies health , corrosive will do corrosive , viral will do viral, if enemies have varying damage resistances to different damage types it will result in different numbers being represented.

5) There is no chance to do critical damage in the explosion- but if your marked attack was critical and did 3K damage as a yellow crit or orange crit , all enemies will be damaged for 3K as a regular attack.

6) Multi shot does not work , only one of the pellets counts (shotguns and snipers with MS will be less effective)

7) Stealth multipliers do not work.

 

Conclusion:

Moderately disappointed with the changes,

Ability now needs targeting the highest health enemy to be even remotely useful.

DE has done a poor job of balancing it and is clear they AGAIN did not really test the abilities before introducing them,

The damage cap based on health should be removed.

 

So while the ability is greatly reduced and you cant see big red numbers - if the damage capping based on max health is removed the ability is still salvageable and effective.

What are your views?

It shouldnt have been released in the initial state, period. 

[Miser_able]

honestly, after testing it myself, the only change I hate is that the effect is completely incapable of killing an enemy. no matter how little health they have

[dEjAvU5566]

I have no comment, just a request.

Rebecca or anyone doing DE stream should do missions with nerfed M4D and show all players how this meet their “original intention”

[IggySnow]

you know an ability is bad when it cant even kill level 1 chargers.

[schilds]

I've had a couple of attempts which have done sufficient damage to kill a pack of heavies, but not sure why. Probably some simulacrum glitch :-P.

[trst]

The problem is that exactly how could this ability ever be balanced when builds like FT Ash exist or even with how powerful our weapons can be per shot?

Without capping the damage somehow it goes right back to instantly killing rooms of enemies. At least in this iteration it can still do so if you take the time to target a heavy unit.

Really this ability shouldn't have been made in the first place.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

Community: this ability is terrible because it doesn't do a full one-shot, only a partial one-shot. So dumb, now I actually have to finish them off with my gun or melee with a few wacks. 

And are you guys capable of testing anything outside the simulacrum? You know there are actual missions in the game, right? 

[ShogunGunshow]

It was only ever a 'problem' in the simulacrum. It was hardly overpowered in practical gameplay.

DE should, at the very least, give the player 100% armor piercing vs. the marked target, because their ideal scenario of targeting a tank mob with a sniper rifle is utter fantasy with the inflated armor values as levels climb.

[Kaggelos]

I hate complaining, but this was very disappointing indeed... 

[_Euphoria_]

All it needed was a range and less % damage cap...... not this

[TsukiMiyaRinna]

I mean MfD can hardly be OP in the first place, no matter how high the damage, it can easily be blocked by terrains and its not like it nukes the whole room either. The ability also does not work well in a squad when someone one-shots everything, even in a steel path bounty, someone with a Mesa can simply kill everything for you.

If it wasn't for the satisfaction of seeing red crits and soloing high level content, I only use this for fun by achieving 99% damage output while only having like 30 kills in a 4 person squad when doing void fissures. You have something like Ember, Mesa, Gauss, Saryn...so many nuke frames that can run Axi fissures with ease, but I just a want frame that can have a bit more button press and higher damage, I don't care about the really small range or 0 punch-through. I just wanna have fun and look fancy, that's it really.

And now it can't even kill lv 1 enemies because of the 75% cap, what a waste of resources and time.
 

[AegisSiege]

12 minutes ago, (PS4)Madurai-Prime said:

Community: this ability is terrible because it doesn't do a full one-shot, only a partial one-shot. So dumb, now I actually have to finish them off with my gun or melee with a few wacks. 

And are you guys capable of testing anything outside the simulacrum? You know there are actual missions in the game, right? 

Tested it on the steel path. Killed nothing. I guess the power was bugged and was getting double bonuses from Mods? Could have just fixed that, and everything would have been okay. For now, it's just a waste of energy. I have removed it from Ash and put him back on the shelf with the other warframes that need a rework. And if I wanted to use guns or melee, I would use a frame that benefits me from doing so. 

[DrivaMain]

Oh poor MfD. How much beating DE gave you. 
 

I have to agree here. They went too far with the nerf. I would be alright if it deals true damage or can apply status, but this is not the case. It also caps out at 75% max HP damage. Right now it cost too much for so little effect.

[AegisSiege]

There are already a ton of room/level clearing powers. It was fun to do it on frames that don't normally get to do that. There is no real reason to have nerfed this, this hard. 

[TsukiMiyaRinna]

 

Quote

There are already a ton of room/level clearing powers. It was fun to do it on frames that don't normally get to do that. There is no real reason to have nerfed this, this hard. 

And MfD wasn't a nuke either, the range is small and you have to be on the same Z axis as the enemies otherwise it won't hit. In missions you have to see whether you cast the ability on the right enemy on the right place, which is fun to do and not a press something to win.

[Tesseract7777]

46 minutes ago, trst said:

The problem is that exactly how could this ability ever be balanced when builds like FT Ash exist or even with how powerful our weapons can be per shot?

Without capping the damage somehow it goes right back to instantly killing rooms of enemies. At least in this iteration it can still do so if you take the time to target a heavy unit.

Really this ability shouldn't have been made in the first place.

You are right, and this all comes down to, if they had some actual, serious players, even literally an actual handful, actually testing this stuff before they released it, it would never get out the door. 

Just have a few real player consultants sign an NDA, not in house whatever DE employees, but truly passionate players, test this stuff beforehand and we would see it. Hell, many players saw all this coming before you could even play test it, but DE didn't. The consultants wouldn't even necessarily need to use a test server to playtest. Many serious veterans could literally just look at say, a proposed ability like that, and take it to it's logical conclusion without even going in game. 

[HolySeraphin]

It seems from some testing that finisher bonus from augments (at least for Banshee and Excal) still apply to the ability, allowing you to kill every enemy as usual. It is likely that they are multiplying the 75% and turning it into 225%+.

Excalibur:

 

Banshee: 

 

[Tesseract7777]

3 minutes ago, HolySeraphin said:

It seems from some testing that finisher bonus from augments (at least for Banshee and Excal) still apply to the ability, allowing you to kill every enemy as usual. It is likely that they are multiplying the 75% and turning it into 225%+.

Excalibur:

 

Banshee: 

 

Probably "not working as intended", just watch them update again tomorrow... they do read general discussion even if they aren't looking for feedback specifically here. 

[ebrl]

Damage caps are such an arbitrary, "we regret making this ability in the first place" change. There were so many ways to balance it - reducing general scaling, reducing base damage, reducing base range, making damage decrease with distance, splitting damage between targets instead of doing full damage to everyone in range, increasing casting time, increasing energy cost, just pick a few of these and force players to invest into the ability (and into their finishers) to achieve the previous effect. But no, DE has the balance chops of a toddler and overreacts by just completely destroying the ability.

[killerJoke66]

im just wondering how many of the helminth stuff will be taken away , M4D was an obvious one but time will tell for others , also please make something about level 9 helminth unlock of an ability that is Expedite Suffering , for an ability that is unlocked at level 9 is a huge dissapointment .

[0_The_F00l]

Added videos.