Assault rifles in this game.

[OoKaioO]

Guys, I really feel like assault rifles in this game needs a buff. I really enjoy the kind of gunplay that assault rifles has to offer unlike nuking the whole map using an explosive bow. However, assault rifles in the current states just feel way too weak not in the case of a single target dmg but when dealing with groups. From my perspective giving all assualt rifles some innate punchthrough(don't even have to be walls, just body) would do it just fine. De please, what do you guys think?

[(XBOX)Shodian]

I think you should put on some punchthrough mods.

[OoKaioO]

Yea, however modding for it using a mod slot makes the rifle feels underwhelming where the mod slot could be used for something else

[(PSN)Tactless_Ninja]

Primed Shred. Fire rate + Punch Through. 

[motorfirebox]

Primaries and secondaries in general are severely underpowered compared to powers and melee. The supposed drawbacks for melee and powers (range and energy cost) are pretty much completely mitigatable with very little trouble—melee range is all but automatically mitigated by mobility, and the options for regenning energy are endless.

I think gun mechanics might need a ground-up rework. For one: just get rid of ammo capacity and pickups. Everybody gets infinite ammo. You still have to reload, but you won't ever run out of reloads.

[Tiltskillet]

3 minutes ago, OoKaioO said:

From my perspective giving all assualt rifles some innate punchthrough(don't even have to be walls, just body)

I've wanted the pure punch through mods to have their amounts increased by a lot.  And possibly have a few exilus mods with very low punch through.

 

[KittySkin]

As others mentioned, Primed Shred and its non primed counterpart are VERY mandatory on assault rifles, that and managing enemies to make them align.

That aside, yeah, assault rifles feels TERRIBLE compared to AOE weapons, specially because the game its so focused arround hordes that the high single target DPS they provide never have a chance to shine.

[(PSN)Madurai-Prime]

If you want to optimize them, use a frame that helps your guns. 

Harrow, Octavia, revenant with his new thrall augment that gives you like 500% damage, nezhas chakram, novas 4, things like shock trooper, frosts 1 augment etc. 

Especially with the 1 augments like embers 1 augment, you can skip a mod and put something else there because the added elemental damage adds to your weapon. So for example if you want viral, you use frosts 1 augment and only have to put toxin mods on your gun. 

 

[ReddyDisco]

"why can't my single target weapon deal with hordes of enemies? just doesn't make sense"

punchthrough won't really help much as its needs enemies to line up one behind the other, but it works wonders paired with a frame that makes excellent use of punchthrough, MAG's bubble plus any projectile weapon with punchthrough is glorious

[_R_o_g_u_e_]

Assault rifles, similar to lasers are really good with hunter munitions.

Once upon a time corrosive was king, and automatic weapons were ideal for applying it. While viral can still be stack up, the first viral proc is the most significant.

Slash is what I would suggest to be the best status type for automatic weapons now. 
 

A slash based auto, with two 60/60 mods to create viral, and built around hunter munitions should definitely kick shins.

That’s how I build my Stradavar, Zenith and Kuva karak. With the Zenith in particular I leave it auto until I get my Smeeta crits, then I toggle it to semi auto.

[TARINunit9]

Since I don't trust DE to nerf Kuva Nukor (nerfing the Kuva Bramma's damage was one thing, but they nerfed the damage AND made it nearly impossible to actually use) and don't expect them to nerf melee. So yes, assault rifles need a buff. They can barely handle sorties, they need to be dealing more damage

[XaoGarrent]

6 hours ago, (XBOX)Shodian said:

I think you should put on some punchthrough mods.

Why do that when you can just select the Rubico Prime.

It has innate punch through and it has higher damage.

AoE weapons and melee aren't the only things that outclass assault rifles. Even before the launcher improvements and the melee patch, assault rifles were bottom of the pack.

[kgabor]

I always use them with frame buffs only, then they are really nice.

Tiberon Prime, crit-status hybrid build+high strength Sonar.

Or just go with the Prisma Grakata and the meme Dakka augment.

[MonsterOfMyOwn]

The kuva Hind and kuva quatrak are good (as far as primary weapons are concerned)

Crit and hunter munition and you can spam slash proc'

[AR3E]

That's sad to admit it, but assault rifles already doing what they should. Sure it's not effective (and casual) like Acceltra or bRammbo. The problem of them in the game is usual shooter gameplay for an unusual Action RPG. We are not a Serious Sam or Doom Slayer, but we have tons of enemies in a single time for slaying. And after one wave new waves will come again, again and again. So without warframe's abilities assault rifles can pretty suck because of aiming every of hundred single targets plus many and long reloads. That's without notation any guns become a trash against high-level mobs except melee, especially against Sentients.

But that's not really matter, for normal gaming and experience assault rifles just should be more comfortable. Normal reload, better fire-rate and also no spool-up for machine-guns because there is actually no reasons for. Except that the only thing can really help them is modules. Like from Borderlands 3 but not only just another boring rocket launcher. I have enough rocket launchers.

[_R_o_g_u_e_]

21 minutes ago, AR3E said:

That's sad to admit it, but assault rifles already doing what they should. Sure it's not effective (and casual) like Acceltra or bRammbo. The problem of them in the game is usual shooter gameplay for an unusual Action RPG. We are not a Serious Sam or Doom Slayer, but we have tons of enemies in a single time for slaying. And after one wave new waves will come again, again and again. So without warframe's abilities assault rifles can pretty suck because of aiming every of hundred single targets plus many and long reloads. That's without notation any guns become a trash against high-level mobs except melee, especially against Sentients.

But that's not really matter, for normal gaming and experience assault rifles just should be more comfortable. Normal reload, better fire-rate and also no spool-up for machine-guns because there is actually no reasons for. Except that the only thing can really help them is modules. Like from Borderlands 3 but not only just another boring rocket launcher. I have enough rocket launchers.

What?

[Marvelous_A]

I remember making a similar thread some time ago and getting all the response that "this buff is not necessary" like this sh1t will make assault rifles OP or something. Some people argue some ammo efficiency bullcrap or try to tell me how they are useful against 500 lvl enemies. Foolish people. These don't mean a sh1t when DE showed the 2020 stats. The same people also turn a blind eye against actual OP stuff like Wukong and Kuva Nukor and they are too afraid to give ARs a bit of extra punchthrough which make them even dumber.

I will say it: bullet based weapons in this game are just useless, 99% of the time. Using one of them effectively cripples your efficiency. A little of innate punchthrough might help, but no amount of punchthrough will make them competitive against the actual good weapons. Honestly I can't imagine giving them punchthrough will harm the game in anyway more than the Catchmoon or Kuna Nukor or Bot Wukong ever did.

[(XBOX)Hyperion Rexx]

I love my AR's.  Karak wraith (then kuva karak), braton prime, stradavar, kuva quartakk (prob not technically an ar but close enough), tiberon, hind, argonak etc etc.   I now love the trumna, its more a heavy machine gun but again, close enough.

The trumna should  be awesome given its so ridiculously expensive to make and, looking at the stats, it looks like it will carve through enemies in a blink.   And against normal star chart it is very good but it really starts to fall off once levels get up above 60ish, which isn't very high at all.   I mean, it gets the job done, eventually, but it takes many shots to kill one enemy and that is the problem with all AR's.   TTK is sloooow for a hoarde shooter, the guns just can't keep up.   

This is why I think we've seen more and more aoe options being introduced with guns, its all they can do to make them remotely viable against the massive aoe and scaling damage of melee.   Its no where near enough though cos the damage doesn't scale.   There's nothing outside of wf abilities that will increase your output, and even that is only a flat increase that will quickly tail off.

Without some form of combo counter and scaling mods similar to those available for melee, guns will always be a very distant second in terms of effectiveness. 

And, going back to the trumna, a really awesome gun, why the feck did de feel the need to gimp it with a FIVE second reload, disable the exilus reload mod, and give it such slow handling and fire rate?   I know, I know, its a big fecking gun.  In real life this would probably be accurate.  We're not in real life though, we're space ninjas using void magic and zipping about in spaceships.   Its like DE are scared to give us a powerful gun. 

[ether.]

I can't agree with you more.

If innate punch through is too much to ask for, at least buff the reload speed

[Brucieman64]

I love the trumna's alt (previus Tonkor boy here), but I find myself more than once finding the auto fire damage be underwhelming. I really would love a gentle nudge towards higher auto weapons dmg ,as it is often nerfed more than its worth. This applies to kitguns too. Why did my lil' rattleguts gain absolutely nothing extra for primary?

[vegetosayajin]

When all of those topics get to the attention of de and primaries and secondaries don't get a buff, but melee get's a nerf...it will be sad and amusing at the same time.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb Brucieman64:

I love the trumna's alt (previus Tonkor boy here), but I find myself more than once finding the auto fire damage be underwhelming. I really would love a gentle nudge towards higher auto weapons dmg ,as it is often nerfed more than its worth. This applies to kitguns too. Why did my lil' rattleguts gain absolutely nothing extra for primary?

Trumna is also one of the few weapons that can be used sensibly.
the devs have also reacted here: enough ammo and usable aoe. besides, it even does enough damage on SP.

but the subject has been chewed enough. the essential was mentioned too often. now it's the turn of devs.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

I reckon they could scale better with stuff like this:

- a system where hitting multiple enemies within a short space of time buffs the damage of the rifle. it encourages aiming at groups and spray-and-pray tactics over trying to kill enemies one by one, which AR's aren't as good at compared to non-AoE Bows and Snipers. buff could also be applied to crit/status chance.

- damage multiplier that increases after each kill, making it easier to take on groups, and most Assault Rifles have a high enough capacity to make this work, it would be especially good on true LMGs like Soma Prime, Trumna and Quellor.

- innate punchthrough, and lots of it, perhaps with a combo multiplier for punchthrough hits/kills.

while you would never see a combo scaling system for ARs in other games, I don't see how AR's in warframe can be made viable without one of some kind.

[Venus-Venera]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb vegetosayajin:

When all of those topics get to the attention of de and primaries and secondaries don't get a buff, but melee get's a nerf...it will be sad and amusing at the same time.

without players they are nothing.
when warframe mutates into a second job, hardly anyone will play it. and i'm definitely not the only one who switched from diablo2 with mods to warframe. balance was never important. but other points are in the foreground.

[ReddyDisco]

One of the few ARs i like using in sp and have quite a bit of fun while doing so is stahlta, primary fire is solid but the secondary fire is what happens when tonkor and opticor have a lovechild, its pretty insane