Eidolon Hunts Being Locked to Day/Night Cycle needs to Go!

[OneFlyingDog]

I am waiting for someone to make the suggestion to just make a boss only mission. That is, you just need to skip the "annoying" get to the boss part.

[Danielw8]

Hunts are fine and is one of the most popular mission in the game. I like the idea of having limited time to do it. If you want a QOL change can be night time rotations every week.

[Jarriaga]

8 hours ago, Drasiel said:

They have displayed the ability to make an instanced (although still clock bound) version of Orb vallis with the profit taker and Exploiter Fights.

You can't pause said "instances" while solo. As I said: There are technical limitations related to the world cycle. They'd have to fully compromise it in order to make it work.

[Drasiel]

9 hours ago, Jarriaga said:

You can't pause said "instances" while solo. As I said: There are technical limitations related to the world cycle. They'd have to fully compromise it in order to make it work.

Not really. The hallway is a loading sequence that spits you out on the plains. It's no different than our ship flying load screen that can take you multiple locations. You'd just need a time locked instance or node that is separate from the plains itself and a way to access it. Now maybe the bounty system itself isn't robust enough to choose between different instances like the mission loader is for normal missions. But all the mechanical pieces are already lying around in the game to make this possible.

[Reaver_X]

even if it was intended to be this way, so what? the community has changed they're minds before, we'd just need to come to a consensus for them to really consider it.

[(PSN)Unstar]

Honestly, I think the time constraints on Eidolons are bad for the community and bad for the culture of Eidolon-hunting.  More than any other meaningful content in the game, Eidolon hunting is where I see the most gatekeeping happening in Recruitment chat.  If you're not already a pro, many groups won't have you...and not to excuse that kind of gatekeeping, but I get where they're coming from.  There's only a short window every now-and-then to do this part of the game, so I understand people wanting to make the most of it when it pops up, because after mistakes or failures you can't just hop right in the mission, but rather need to wait an arbitrary length of time to try again with a full timer.

It's not great that the veteran and newbs for this kind of content are so segregated.  And what exacerbates this gap even more is that newbies can only practice during certain hours.  And heck, we all have real lives and schedules we have to keep.  If someone can only play from 6-to-7, that's plenty of time to play some missions, but if it's not night on the Plains, newbs and vets alike can't experience it.

It seems like a system that disadvantages everyone and encourages a less-than-inclusive mindset, all for no benefit besides the lore of a day-night cycle.  I think it would be positive for everyone if there were no longer a limitation on when players could engage with specific missions like Eidolon hunting.

[(PSN)SHINOBISERPENT]

I don't know. I think it's part of the fun. Like, REAAAALLY think about it. How many people do profit taker? How many squads can you find that want to do that? Same for exploiter orb. How many people want to get a good squad together and enjoy doing that? Now think about how often amd easy it is to find an eidolon group. Waaaaay easier right? I think the exclusivity plays a role in the eidolon hunt's fun. If you could do eidolons at all times, do you think people would want to speedrun them and bring the best gear? Especially if they didn't have to? Do you think they would still have the same skill factor?

[S.Dust]

I think it should stay as is I really don't see the issue, its a mechanic unique to a location it makes sense. As far as people not being able to farm it sometimes that shouldn't be DE's problem it's no different than a player not being able to get on for an event, you can easily find the cycle online if you really want to only get on for eidolons. DE shouldn't change an entire fight and mechanic to fit peoples schedules when it comes up plenty often enough. Also I think part of the reason it is that way is so that the arcane market doesn't get too over saturated or so that arcanes keep some semblance of worth.

[(PSN)DoctorWho_90250]

Create a daytime Eidolon who, in lore, is searching for the night Eidolons. Maybe The New War comes with a new Eidolon who is meant to unite with the others but, because of our actions, only comes out during the day.

[Lutesque]

2 hours ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

I don't know. I think it's part of the fun. Like, REAAAALLY think about it. How many people do profit taker? How many squads can you find that want to do that? Same for exploiter orb. How many people want to get a good squad together and enjoy doing that? Now think about how often amd easy it is to find an eidolon group. Waaaaay easier right? I think the exclusivity plays a role in the eidolon hunt's fun. If you could do eidolons at all times, do you think people would want to speedrun them and bring the best gear? Especially if they didn't have to? Do you think they would still have the same skill factor?

Probably not.... But they would be significantly less Toxic and Stressful and quite Frankly I place that above any benefits time limitations can bring....

 

FYI... People Speed Run Profit Taker and Exploiter all the time....just because you can do them anytime doesn't mean you want to be there forever.

1 hour ago, S.Dust said:

DE shouldn't change an entire fight and mechanic to fit peoples schedules when it comes up plenty often enough.

How on earth would this change any Mechanics ? 🤔 I'm pretty sure Eidolons would just feel the same except you'l be able to See since the sun would be out.... You make it sound like they are going to Start Breakdancing randomly all over the Plains.

1 hour ago, S.Dust said:

. Also I think part of the reason it is that way is so that the arcane market doesn't get too over saturated or so that arcanes keep some semblance of worth.

They can just find something else to sell.... I hear Lato and Braton Vandal are pretty pricey.... They can farm those....😝

 

[(NSW)Mbek]

3 hours ago, Drasiel said:

Not really. The hallway is a loading sequence that spits you out on the plains. It's no different than our ship flying load screen that can take you multiple locations. You'd just need a time locked instance or node that is separate from the plains itself and a way to access it. Now maybe the bounty system itself isn't robust enough to choose between different instances like the mission loader is for normal missions. But all the mechanical pieces are already lying around in the game to make this possible.

What happen at Gara's quest when Teralyst supposed to spawn but the sun's out? Did they force it to spawn at day time or force you to enter night time plains? If it's the former then they can make eidolons also spawn at day only when you pick their bounty, if the latter then it should be possible to enter instanced night time.

[Kaotyke]

36 minutes ago, (NSW)Mbek said:

What happen at Gara's quest when Teralyst supposed to spawn but the sun's out?

No, the sun is not out.

The Quest turns the day into night so you can have Terry spawn and have Hek say "Its... beautiful. Its so beautiful... KILL IT!"

 

[Drasiel]

5 hours ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

I don't know. I think it's part of the fun. Like, REAAAALLY think about it. How many people do profit taker? How many squads can you find that want to do that? Same for exploiter orb. How many people want to get a good squad together and enjoy doing that? Now think about how often amd easy it is to find an eidolon group. Waaaaay easier right? I think the exclusivity plays a role in the eidolon hunt's fun. If you could do eidolons at all times, do you think people would want to speedrun them and bring the best gear? Especially if they didn't have to? Do you think they would still have the same skill factor?

Here's thing though: you don't need to pre form a group for profit taker because it doesn't require set roles to clear it in a timely manner. If you do want a group all you have to do is public queue. I have never failed to get a group public queuing for profit taker, to the point that because I didn't have fun with chroma's speed clearing stages I now run it solo.

Making eidolons more accessible won't change that you want specific loadouts to speed clear them. People are always going to want to speed clear eidolons because it's the most effective way to get arcanes still. There's nothing preventing the anytime eidolon bounty from having a mission time limit that force extracts you with all your stuff at the end of it (manually having the option to exit earlier via the gate also saving your stuff). 

  edit: missed this

2 hours ago, (NSW)Mbek said:

What happen at Gara's quest when Teralyst supposed to spawn but the sun's out? Did they force it to spawn at day time or force you to enter night time plains? If it's the former then they can make eidolons also spawn at day only when you pick their bounty, if the latter then it should be possible to enter instanced night time.

you are correct! it's the latter. From the wiki:

Quote

Saya's Vigil: Plains of Eidolon, Earth

Location: Plains of Eidolon, Earth
Enemy Level: 5 - 8

Note: this phase of the quest will always put players at the Plains of Eidolon in nighttime, regardless of the Plain's actual time of day.

This is a very good point you've brought up. That section of the quest proves that a special night time instance is accessible at least via the quest system. It's been years since I played that quest so I didn't even think of it.

[stormy505]

5 hours ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

I don't know. I think it's part of the fun. Like, REAAAALLY think about it. How many people do profit taker? How many squads can you find that want to do that? Same for exploiter orb. How many people want to get a good squad together and enjoy doing that? Now think about how often amd easy it is to find an eidolon group. Waaaaay easier right? I think the exclusivity plays a role in the eidolon hunt's fun. If you could do eidolons at all times, do you think people would want to speedrun them and bring the best gear? Especially if they didn't have to? Do you think they would still have the same skill factor?

Apples to oranges.

1. Orbs don't have roles for optimally clearing them so people don't search for groups.

2. Orbs rewards aren't as evergreen as eidolons so players move on faster.

3. Orb rewards also aren't worth plat which decreases interest.

They really don't have a lot in common.

Only downside with removing timegates: increases accessibility and decreases gatekeeping which increases the supply of arcanes and decreases the demand for them lowering prices. But that's only a downside for a very small portion of players.

[0_The_F00l]

6 hours ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

I don't know.

This is the part which I think you are most accurate about 

6 hours ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

I think it's part of the fun. 

Fun is subjective ,

6 hours ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

Like, REAAAALLY think about it. How many people do profit taker? How many squads can you find that want to do that? Same for exploiter orb. How many people want to get a good squad together and enjoy doing that? Now think about how often amd easy it is to find an eidolon group. Waaaaay easier right? I think the exclusivity plays a role in the eidolon hunt's fun. If you could do eidolons at all times, do you think people would want to speedrun them and bring the best gear? Especially if they didn't have to? Do you think they would still have the same skill factor?

That's a terrible comparison , 

Orbs don't have a requirements for multiple roles and co ordination , so people can solo it bypassing the need to have squads.

Orbs also don't have a chain boss mechanic requiring all previous bosses to be defeated for next one to spawn. Thus putting emphasis on efficiency.

Orbs don't have lures needing regular upkeep and charging.

Orbs don't teleport away if you screw up.

They also don't have rewards that are in demand at all times.

As you can see there are multiple reasons why orbs differ from eidolons hunts beyond just the day night cycle.

[Lutesque]

7 hours ago, (NSW)Mbek said:

What happen at Gara's quest when Teralyst supposed to spawn but the sun's out? Did they force it to spawn at day time or force you to enter night time plains?

Yep.... You start the mission from your Orbiter so when you arrive in Cetus you get a Permanent Night Time Instance just for the Quest.... Or I could be wrong... I think the sun does actually come up but the Terralyst will stick around.... And if you Brought your Amp with you... You can Kill It 😝 which will bug the Quest requiring a restart.

5 hours ago, Drasiel said:

Making eidolons more accessible won't change that you want specific loadouts to speed clear them.

In the case of The Hydrolyst... Speed is mandatory because it can actually delay your Efforts to Capture it... Indefinitely.... The insane damage it does is just a Bonus on top of that.

4 hours ago, stormy505 said:

 

Only downside with removing timegates: increases accessibility and decreases gatekeeping which increases the supply of arcanes and decreases the demand for them lowering prices. But that's only a downside for a very small portion of players

Plague Star already deValued them anyway so they may aswel just make any time Eidolons.... The days of 10 000 Platinum Arcane Energize is over....

 

 

 

[(PSN)drpunk-yo]

It'd be easier to care less about 7000 nightwave standing than it would be to ban nighttime.

[Merrcenary]

eidolons are fine. if you don't like earth cycles - orphix available 24/7 and waiting for you

[Drasiel]

15 hours ago, Merrcenary said:

eidolons are fine. if you don't like earth cycles - orphix available 24/7 and waiting for you

unless your goal isn't arcanes and just to fight the eidolons themselves then the continuing "only on night cycle" remains a problem.

[Lokanahta]

Why don't they just add a new boss that roams during daytime? You could make the arcane pool smaller for both bosses and have less time-gating. Idk, I'd be more interested in that.

[-Moctezuma-]

cry about it

[(PSN)SHINOBISERPENT]

On 2021-09-22 at 12:00 AM, 0_The_F00l said:

This is the part which I think you are most accurate about 

Fun is subjective ,

That's a terrible comparison , 

Orbs don't have a requirements for multiple roles and co ordination , so people can solo it bypassing the need to have squads.

You're just making excuses. People solo tridolons all the time. How about you get gud and enjoy the night phase which was announced at reveal to be "HARDER" than the day time. Where "EIDOLONS roamed and it will dangerous for lower level players." Stop making excuses. They did do anything unintentional. You are supposed to see night time, think "oh crap, guess I better get a good squad and work together to take down this beast" there's a reason racing games have a time constraint. Time constraints have been used in numerous games as another form of added challenge. If you don't know WHY time constraints are used, then you need to shut up and listen for once because eidolons are supposed to be hard and you are supposed to prepare and have gear good enough to kill them within the given time. Either get gud or come back later.

[(PSN)SHINOBISERPENT]

15 hours ago, Lokanahta said:

Why don't they just add a new boss that roams during daytime? You could make the arcane pool smaller for both bosses and have less time-gating. Idk, I'd be more interested in that.

They do have bosses that you can do in the day time. They're called the orb mothers and they can be played at any time and they are easy as balls because you don't have a time constraint except for the profit taker. And look how well they are doing. People don't want to play them. You know nothing about basic human desire. If you have all the apples in the world, monke don't want apple no more. If ypu have all banana in the world, monke eventually dont. Want. Banana. Make sense? Monke hypothetically live forever, have all time to do whateveer monke wants, monke do nothing. Monke have no constraints. Monke have no reason to use time to it's best value. Monke have time constraint, maybe it worth working for banana. Maybe monke want to have fun with time he has. 

Life is a time gate. You live and you die. So you make the most of it. The only difference in video games is that you can do it again.

[0_The_F00l]

2 minutes ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

You're just making excuses. People solo tridolons all the time. How about you get gud and enjoy the night phase which was announced at reveal to be "HARDER" than the day time. Where "EIDOLONS roamed and it will dangerous for lower level players." Stop making excuses. They did do anything unintentional. You are supposed to see night time, think "oh crap, guess I better get a good squad and work together to take down this beast" there's a reason racing games have a time constraint. Time constraints have been used in numerous games as another form of added challenge. If you don't know WHY time constraints are used, then you need to shut up and listen for once because eidolons are supposed to be hard and you are supposed to prepare and have gear good enough to kill them within the given time. Either get gud or come back later.

Hmm , probably should have said players can solo or Pub orbs with little effort as compared to tridolons that need pre made squads to be effective. I have actually solo'd tridolons a few times myself so use your "git gud" argument on someone actually needing to git gud. I simply dont enjoy them as a mechanic and stopped once i maxed my focus skills.

I have no idea where racing games came into the picture and what you meant by unintentional , you will need to be clear if you want people to understand you.

Time constraints exist in many games true, but usually not tied with actual out of game times, it is usually associated with in game triggers. You can still have a 15 to 45 minute time constraint but you can decide when that timer starts.

Being condescending is also not gonna help if you want other people to listen , especially telling them to shut up will usually make them be louder, sound logical reasoning will be heard better than angry noise.

Also Eidolons are not harder , they just need better management of time and resources , none of which will change if you are permitted to enter an instanced zone with its own time constraint. I do not really care for doing Tridolons back to back, but i would like players like me who only log in once a day for a few minutes to have the option to play what i want without needing to set an alarm or reminder for it.

You also have ignored most of my other points which talk about actual differences mechanically between the fights,

[Lutesque]

55 minutes ago, (PSN)SHINOBISERPENT said:

Either get gud or come back later.

 😐 Not Cool...