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[DE]Danielle

Melee Revisit: Phase 1 Feedback Megathread

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4 hours ago, (PS4)Lei-Lei_23 said:

With the NSW I can sympathize on this issue, since the form factor when holding it in your hands your right thumb is immediately on the face buttons. If you want to do directional slams, you need to position your thumb from above the face buttons and claw to the right analog stick which is some distance away from any keybind that you had on the face buttons (which could possibly be melee). That’s pretty uncomfortable if you’re not using the joypad.

At least with PS4 and Xb1, or most PC controllers, the right analog stick is positioned below the face buttons fairly close by, near your grip. Here, it works for twitch reactions of directing your camera to do directional slams with a mere flick (I’ve been playing reverse Y-axis since the start of Warframe, so looking down is pushing the right analog up). With NSW, there’s a marginal distance between the analog stick and face buttons to make any of these reactions and could cause physical distress on your hands if you’re not careful.

Actually, just aim glide for a sec after jumping upwards.

That gives you time to adjust the angle.

I play on Switch and it works for me...

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

Yes, which is why I'm hoping these complaints don't get listened to.

 

Why didn't you quote the whole statement? Clearly there are suggestions that will not affect the likes of you nor other player bases for the worst. Furthermore your posts have been mostly complaints about other players genuine feedback and experiences. You still make assumptions with no real way of measurements but yet the feedback shows a clear pattern and majority. Even though suggestions are geared towards keeping both new melee and adding options to make melee exclusive selection optional as well as auto block which will not affect the new melee you still campaign to make clever insults and try to discredit others feedback. As if outright classing an entire player base as a minority hence their feedback doesn't matter wasnt bad enough you still come back yet again to imply that they are a minority which is why "you" hope they don't listen irrespective of the fact that the suggestions will not affect the new implementations. Good luck to your agenda.

Edited by SilviaS12
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Posted (edited)

Though Ive been enjoying the changes made, the right click combos, while working okay-ish, have the annoying habit of swapping back to the gun you were using as soon as you stop melee-ing. This is 1)inconvenient, since it removes the auto-parry that one might be using, and though non-attack melee to weapon swap is nigh instant, nigh is not instant. 2)extremely cumbersome for "melee uses gun trigger" players, such as me, since that to keep melee-ing, they now have to alternate between left clicking and "E" whenever they execute a block combo.

If it was possible to make the character not swap back to their gun whenever a block combo is executed, that would be greatly appreciated. 

Edited by tnccs215
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11 minutes ago, SilviaS12 said:

your posts have been mostly complaints about other players genuine feedback and experiences

No, they were replies to complaints about my genuine feedback and positive experience. Funny how that works, hm? Accusing others of what oneself is guilty of is a classic technique of manipulation.

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, SordidDreams said:

No, they were replies to complaints about my genuine feedback and positive experience. Funny how that works, hm? Accusing others of what oneself is guilty of is a classic technique of manipulation.

Actually you are the manipulator here. You diliberately misquote comments and try to make them sound like something else to suit your agenda.

Edited by SilviaS12
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Posted (edited)

Silvia, Sordid, can you two take that particular argument to PM's or something?

It's already clear that you disagree with each other; let's just leave it at agreeing to disagree, so that this doesn't escalate into someone getting moderator attention that no one wants...

Edited by (NSW)Smashbrolink

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4 minutes ago, (NSW)Smashbrolink said:

Silvia, Sordid, can you two take that particular argument to PM's or something?

It's already clear that you disagree with each other; let's just leave it at agreeing to disagree, so that this doesn't escalate into someone getting moderator attention that no one wants...

Agreed indeed.

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Is this a bug or is it intended ?

Ivara can no longer speed up or slow down a glaive when it's thrown. Instead pressing LMB (which normally speeds up), will cause the thrown glaive to now explode (note, dual welding glaive with a single pistol seems to be fine, at least it functions with the speed up and slow down correctly). Considering glaives function best with Ivara's navigator, (literally one of the best weapon types to navigate), I would like to know if this is a bug or not.

 

 

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4 hours ago, (PS4)Gerbizzzle said:

Couple issues I had right off the bat:

If I have a primary and melee equipped and I’m carrying something (mobile defense hack tool) i can’t aim glide! If I do, my primary is pulled out and I drop the pickup. That happened several times during the sortie before I figured out what was happening! It actually dropped down a trench and it took a few minutes to try and retrieve it because it kept fading to black and spawning us back at the top.

 

Second issue is, the quick melee is gone! Most of the melee weapons I enjoy using are specifically BECAUSE of the quick melee. They keep your forward movement without stopping you to complete the combo. But now, I’m defaulted to just start the whole combo (very problematic for Sigma & Octantis for instance, since I just fly around with the whole combo and more than half the time miss my intended target). 

Exactly quick melee going forward is what i liked. Orthos prime is what i used a ton using only the quick melee 90% of the time instead of worrying about the stance an such. DE trippin.. why fix what's not broken. Melee was fine. 

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Melee 2.99 has been great fun while using Lesion with Shimmering Blight.  Being able to for eg use melee on Corpus, see a Nullifier Bubble come up, seamlessly shot the drone so the bubble pops, then take out the Crewman with Lesion is great fun.  Love that aspect of it!  Great job.  Like the little touches like being able to reload the gun immediately from holding a melee weapon.

My only concern now is that since there is no longer any quick melee, the feel of melee is dependent on how well the stances work for your playstyle.  Up until now I could just ignore stances and treat them as + mod point mods.  Some stances are way too locked in their combos and have ornate flourishes that take way too long or force you to move in ways over which you have no control (Cleaving Whirlwind for eg makes me launch into a jump I don't want with Gram Prime!).  Others have combo chains that go very very deep and it's difficult to control or break out of them in the heat of battle.

I mentioned Lesion above because Shimmering Blight is a simple and relatively unintrusive stance, one that lets you have more control over motion and attack compared to others.

I believe you've already mentioned taking away some of the timing based aspects of combo control, but please also consider releasing some stances that have very flat combos or ones in which the player retains full control over motion, speed and direction.

This is a good first step and the fluidity is fun and very in keeping with the rest of the game, so please keep that as is!  Stances do need a lot of love, it is no longer possible for the player to simply ignore them if they want to in battle.

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Overall, I'm really excited about the melee. The effects are amazing and I like the faster swap between my secondary knives and my melee. I have noticed a few issues with it however. The first one is that, although they are stunning, the melee special effects can block my vision I do combos, so maybe tone them back a bit during the combos. The second is Valkyr's hysteria looking like it shuts off when I accidentally swapped to melee. Maybe make it turn off? Or give a sign besides energy drain that it's still on. The third, while not a problem for me, is that some of my ranged focused teammates liked the temporary swap to melee and swap back, so maybe make it an option? I like the new permeant swap back and forth but get where they came from for ranged focused players. Other than these, I love the new melee system and am excited to keep playing with them!

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The faster weapon switching? Great! Should have done that from the get go. Tightening up those weapon switch times could have been done without an entirely new system that apparently requires it to be implemented in phases rather than, ya know, just finishing a complete product first THEN implementing it.

But as far as great things, the list honestly ends there for me. I use Guardian Derision. I use Electromagnetic Shielding. I enjoy being able to support my allies by drawing enemy fire and lowering their incoming damage. All of that... ALL OF THAT... relied on the ability to manually block. Now, if I want any hope of defending allies or getting the attention of enemies, I have to physically interject myself between them and the enemy like an entitled parent coming to the rescue of their precious gremlin. If all else remains the same, the blocking must change or else these mods need to be reworked to be always on when the melee weapon is drawn. That doesn't even begin to address the problem of having a stray pea shot in your direction while doing parkour sending you into super slow Peter Pan mode.

Come on DE...

NWg5o3I.jpg

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Day 2 cant even play warframe  this is messing us up in getting new objective done. You cant even alter the controls manually which is just wrong. Please make a alternate in game controllers so folks can choose thire game style. And so the rest of us can  play the game that we believed in and gave up on other games the assist you with. Anyone whom plays WARFRAME and is dissing those of us that now cant play at all should be ashamed. There are simple solutions and your stating we dont matter. If that is the mass  thought I would like a refund of the plat payed to this company with in the last week as this in not fair nor right. 

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As a Melee player, this new update's done a lot of damage to my enjoyment of the game.
Whilst some features of the new update are really nice, it feels as if it's watering down the melee experience, and catering exclusively to Gunplay.

By removing the block button and making melee blocking automatic, it takes a degree of depth out of being a melee player, and further takes control way from the player.
Warframe powers that do their own thing whilst activated are cool, but weapons have been the one thing that we players have always had to control directly.
Being able to control whether or not my warframe blocked enabled me to use Rage and Hunter's Adrenaline to make a powerful Melee/power build, but now I have to turn around to take the damage.

I understand that making blocking automatic makes the game easier for gun players to switch between guns and melee without having to worry about blocking, but it also takes all the depth out of the game for players that only carry firearms as a back-up weapon.
It would have been a lot better if the quick-melee button were to be replaced with a quick switch between melee and firearms, without holstering delays.

I think I'll be spending some time on other games until something is changed.
I've spent a lot of plat getting my melee weapons to where they are now, and I'm a bit disheartened by how swords feel like they're playing second fiddle to guns at the moment.
Hope to play again in the future.

 

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I really, really REALLY don't understand why you guys removed dedicated melee by holding weapon swap button.

There's nothing that currently occupies that button , yet you took it out. Leaving it in would have allowed melee fans to retain the ability to have their dedicated melee channel , blocking and old combos that used those inputs, while still allowing the changes made to quick melee to be accessible when using firearms.

Maybe if you took the time and rebound Archgun to weapon swap hold, I could have understood, but there's NOTHING BOUND THERE ANYMORE... Why remove a perfectily fine melee weapon setup.

Even worse, for some reason you decided that people could use the old setup, but only when they only have a sword equipped... Why ? Makes no sense.... Just re-enable holding for dedicated melee.

Also, for quick melee, just make frames and operators always run already and reclaim the button for blocking....

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vor 3 Stunden schrieb (PS4)saniglenn:

By removing the block button and making melee blocking automatic, it takes a degree of depth out of being a melee player

Depth??? xD

Yeah, holding a button all the time is totally inceasing gameplay depth...

A few months back, when people were demanding auto-block they argued that it was needed for reducing because it was overcomplicating the game...

Both sides are wrong.

Holding a single button neither overcomplicates something nor does it a depth do gameplay.

It's a small detail that doesn't matter.

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1 minute ago, Walkampf said:

Depth??? xD

Yeah, holding a button all the time is totally inceasing gameplay depth...

A few months back, when people were demanding auto-block they argued that it was needed for reducing because it was overcomplicating the game...

Both sides are wrong.

Holding a single button neither overcomplicates something nor does it a depth do gameplay.

It's a small detail that doesn't matter.

simple solution for both sides of the fence, a toggle switch for those who want it and those who don't want it, and a toggle for weapon switch to melee as well or to lock into melee while having guns equipped, so no one loses anything and most will be happy.

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Feeling kinda disenfranchised here as a melee Tenno.
This update seems to have one goal; stripping away the depth of melee combat so it can fit more neatly in a gun-users playstyle.
But what about those of us that take out our melee weapons at the start of the mission?

Removing the ability to block manually and replacing it with automatic blocking takes a great deal of control away from the players; there's quite simply less game for us to play now that the game handles that for us.
Not to mention the negative effects it has on mods like Rage and Hunter's Adrenaline.

I'm unhappy with this update.
I can't play the game at all since my favorite aspect of the game has been ruined.
All I'd need to fix it is automatic blocking to either be removed or a toggle-off option added.

But for now, I have to find something else to play.
 

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vor 3 Minuten schrieb SilviaS12:

simple solution for both sides of the fence, a toggle switch for those who want it and those who don't want it, and a toggle for weapon switch to melee as well or to lock into melee while having guns equipped, so no one loses anything and most will be happy.

That whould be the easiest. They did the same with archwing controls.

The issue is:

We as players don't know what else is planned for the comming phases.

This is jsut a thought, but maybe theya need to free up a button for something comming later.

On PC, adding buttons isn't much of an issue,

but console players are limitied through their controllers.

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Posted (edited)
18 minutes ago, Walkampf said:

That whould be the easiest. They did the same with archwing controls.

The issue is:

We as players don't know what else is planned for the comming phases.

This is jsut a thought, but maybe theya need to free up a button for something comming later.

On PC, adding buttons isn't much of an issue,

but console players are limitied through their controllers.

Good point. I am sure the toggle can be done in settings for auto block. and give back key bindings for melee weapon switch. Lets hope they do it for all Tennokind console or pc everyone good.

Edited by SilviaS12

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Posted (edited)

Recently I have posted a suggestion here, about adding a new option to let us switch between the old melee configuration and this melee 3.0.

Today I have maybe an even better idea: how about introducing a new customization window in game, the Advanced Combat Settings.

From this new panel you will have access to some new settings, and they will let you choose if you wanna change specific aspects of the combat mechanics, and they can override the old default configurations.

 

For example you get something like:

Melee Block: auto / manual

Melee-Gun Weapon Switching: F button / Switch immediately on shoot or melee attack

Ground Slam: Straight down / Directional

 

With a handy customization window like this, players can choose the settings they prefer in every detail! And also this allows the addition of even more melee combat styles and configurations in the future, and the players will simply choose which one to apply!!

Edited by Heidelgard
Typo, adjustements.
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5 hours ago, Walkampf said:

Depth??? xD

Yeah, holding a button all the time is totally inceasing gameplay depth...

 

Holding a button to block when you wish to reduce damage, and not holding that button when you wish to take damage adds depth.
The players that demanded auto-block are primarily GUN players, they don't spend as much time with their melee weapons out as melee players do.

Ultimately, it is a tremendous detail that does matter, it has stopped many people from playing altogether.

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vor 2 Minuten schrieb (PS4)saniglenn:

when you wish to take damage adds depth.

Just switch to your gun if you want to take damage.

This whole autoblocking-Gate is nothing but some princesses sleeping on peas.

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