Feedback on Wolf of Saturn Six

[seprent]

Radiation Damage It is highly effective against the Alloy Armor worn by many high-level Grineer units, Corpus Robotics and larger Eidolon , but is penalized against Corpus Shields and most Infested foes.

1. +75% base damage to alloy armor
2.  only reduced by 25% of enemy alloy armor 

also additionally, after the fourth episode of Nightwave Series 1, he becomes vulnerable to Damage to Sentients effect. so operator his face also works he also cannot see invisible tenno so cheeky rad crit melee weapons are grand for killing him if you run say a ivara or loki  

everything in the game on paper needs a specific build to kill effectively but add enough to the numbers you invalidate the need to prepare the wolf is reminding you of it my advice get a rad crit puncture weapon as puncture is also effective against alloy armor so your getting more bang for bullet

so the only specific is carrying at-least one weapon with him in mind till this blows over you can get more specific to him if you want but thats up to you 

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

2 hours ago, (PS4)Zero_029 said:

Is this actually an issue outside of Hydron? I don't pub often so this would be news to me.

Hydron, sanctuary, same same. But the same mentality spreads to eidolon hunting pubs, sorties, the GOTL alerts: whatever I take is good enough, because I am good enough. There's seldom a drive to do better. I've seen people get told off for offering legitimate advice by people who did poorly. 

Quote

My response was more in lone with the constant: Take ___ weapon/kavat/frame replies.

The replies are general guides, not a be all and end all. High crit rad damage is general advice and can be applied as you wish, according to your means. 

I take Rhino because I enjoy him, he controls the fugitives and buffs my damage, but we both know that chroma is better at dealing mad damage. 

Quote

Before PoE were Snipers really a weapon anyone carried?

Even after PoE, since when did anyone want to bring these to missions.

I know a Sniper is NOT what I think to bring to a Defense (Hydron) mission. So when I see folks telling people "Bring a Sniper to that close quarters mission just in case that 6% spawn occurs." Just...irritates me.

Who has said that you have to bring a sniper rifle to hydron? People have said what they take. I have pointed out that those eidolon hunting rifles are something that we probably all have that's already purpose built for the exact same purpose so if that works for you, great. You can take shotguns, my catchmoon is a pocket arca plasmor that packs one hell of a punch with its crits. Choose something that works for you and adjust the build for high crits and radiation. If you like melee more, do that, and use your combo counter to your advantage. 

Quote

They probably weren't tossed out. Not many new players think to use em. Even if they did have pizzas....they'd be so weak you'd never notice them. As for specters...yeah. Barely anyone uses them. Let alone add them to the gear wheel. My recent experiences teaching newbies has shown me this.

Trust me. My Rhino notices energy, because I built him with a small pool, and when the wolf shows I roar and stomp and face tank if needed to keep him away from the objective. So if I need to put iron skin back on, it's a close thing unless there's orbs around or I'm willing and able to dash. 

Any energy pizza has a significant impact on him unless I literally just topped up or there are a few orbs nearby. 

I agree that few use them, but they're helpful to distract the wolf and keep him tied up, while everyone slams him. 

I was in a run as host where two wolf hunters bailed prematurely at wave 5, the other guy wanted to go on so I went along (needed a little more xp for the rifle I was levelling. . Host migration. He got host and tossed out a couple of spectres to help him hold the objective, I thought that wise given his squishy frame and low level gear.

Wolf howls. I roar, iron skin, and toss an energy pizza to replenish me. Then I start shooting, stomp and notice the wolf standing along the back wall smashing spectre after spectre. This dude must've been tossing them out like candy. Doesn't matter how much damage he did vs what I did. That dude won the fight for us, because he used what he had to benefit the squad. 

Quote

Last Hydron I did where Wolf Spawned...I ended up soloing him while another player spammed Simulor shots that did no dmg to him but successfully blinded me in the process. Haha. God that was hell...don't worry...my hard work earned us a North Wind. 😰

Yeah. Your hard work. Because for all of his "contribution" he did no meaningful damage and didn't actually help the squad, did he? Speaking of which;

 

2 hours ago, Aldain said:

I have literally never been in a mission where no player doesn't at least contribute something to a mission, not counting afk leech players who do nothing at all.

When one player pulls off over 50% of the damage without spamming aoe nuking abilities, you begin to wonder how much meaningful damage the other members of the squad are doing. When the wolf shows up and that turns into 80% or more, and the other frames aren't support frames..... You can stop wondering. 

2 hours ago, Aldain said:

Even on Hydron most people will have at least their Warframe's abilities to fall back on, and honestly, even an unranked potato'd weapon can keep up with the Grinner there for 5 wave provided damage mods are slotted in.

And that's part of the problem. We're usually powerful enough to go naked as a newborn baby and wipe out the weaker enemies. But if we do that, we'll find out to our cost that not all enemies can be wiped out so easily. 

Now the question is, do we learn and come back better prepared, and stronger? Or do we whine about it not being easy enough? 

 

[-CdG-Zilchy]

I'm willing to bet that at least 75% of the complaints stem from encounters in Hydron. I was farming the wolf the other day by going Hydron public matches. I don't know where the idea of there not being many MR 13+ players comes from cos hydron was full of them. I had 1 MR 26 bring a rank 0 Loki and 3 rank 0 weapons. He died at the start of the 1st wave, I didn't pick him up cos he should know better. He abused me and left the game. Came back in the next match I played too, died and abused me again.

Not all of them mind you but the sheer amount of players that came in with rank 0 weapons and very little to contribute with was incredible. The only time anybody helped out was if they brought a DPS frame to level, the rest of the time my chroma armed with a Guandao did about 75 - 90% of the damage per mission, 5 waves, extract, rinse n repeat, waiting for Wolf. He spawned 3 times, twice the team I was with was groaning and hating it and the other time they said bring it on and protected the objective for me. Each time he popped I told the team I'd kill him and dropped him in around 2 minutes.

The funniest part is my Guandao was also built for radiation at the time and the weirdest thing, I was able to chop all the enemies apart on Hydron despite using such a "weak" damage type... lol. This BS about equipping radiation damage being so detrimental is just that, BS. The power creep in this game at the moment is firmly in our favour, the only point it matters what damage type you brought is when you go a few hours deep into an endless mission. Who cares if it takes 2 bullets instead of 1 to kill that heavy gunner, really weak excuse for not trying, seriously.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Zilchy

[0_The_F00l]

I just ignore him with magus lock down until it's time to extract. 

[-CdG-Zilchy]

Do the exact same thing I had to do for over a YEAR whenever the original stalker showed up to whoop my ass. Fight as valiantly as I could, die heroically, respawn and continue with my mission. Hell he doesn't even taunt you like stalker used to 😞

And you're thinking "A year? LOL git gud noob." Yeh.. max rank back then was MR 12, we didn't have easy ways to get godly weaponry back then and he was a lot scarier when he actually used Dread compared to the weak sauce version we have now.

Edited April 30, 2019 by Zilchy

[McGoodGreen]

3 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

Treat him like the G3, i.e. allow the player to simply run away to extraction if they don't feel like fighting him.

Y'know, this is the first time I have seen this mentioned as an alternative. And I like it. 

Originally, I was gonna say, The Wolf acts like an Assassin, and they all work relatively the same way. They are there to throw your game off. Only real disadvantage is not being marked by him in your profile so not really knowing if he can crop up. But the more I think about it, the more I like the idea of those who cannot handle him, or are unprepared for him, getting to run isn't so bad. 

[-CdG-Zilchy]

6 hours ago, LSG501 said:

It might be at the extreme end of the argument but it's no different to those that are saying its not requiring specific builds to beat him in a timely manner. 

You can say take exalted frames but not everyone wants to take an exalted frame, why should we NEED to take exalted frames specifically in case we run into the wolf, we don't need to against any other assassin.  Status weapons are far more effective long term than crit weapons etc but again why should we need to take a crit weapon specifically in case we encounter the wolf, no other assassin requires that we do.  

 

You obviously weren't around when Second Dream was added to the game. I would've loved to see you make the same argument every time shadow stalker came and beat you down. 

You also don't need an exalted frame or any particular frame for that matter, I've killed him with loki, limbo, nova, inaros, mesa and chroma so far

Edited April 30, 2019 by Zilchy

[(PSN)guzmantt1977]

28 minutes ago, Zilchy said:

I'm willing to bet that at least 75% of the complaints stem from encounters in Hydron. I was farming the wolf the other day by going Hydron public matches. I don't know where the idea of there not being many MR 13+ players comes from cos hydron was full of them. I had 1 MR 26 bring a rank 0 Loki and 3 rank 0 weapons. He died at the start of the 1st wave, I didn't pick him up cos he should know better. He abused me and left the game. Came back in the next match I played too, died and abused me again.

Last mission Hydron extract was at wave 10: MR 18, equinox p. L10; Dex furis L26. 

MR 21 Valkyr p. L30 multiple weapons L30 one at L25. 

MR 20 Valkyr L26 single weapon rank 0 not even a sentinel or companion. 

Myself. MR 16. Did over 50% of the damage and 46% of kills. A substantial number of my kills were with a primary with a build I messed up, to give gas damage for the daily. 

I don't know what figures exist, but anecdotally, I see many above my rank. 

[-CdG-Zilchy]

5 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Every single assassin requires that we do. It's just that many of us already take more than enough firepower to deal with them but newbs still get destroyed by them.

The difference is a matter of degrees, nothing else. 

Spot on, I was doing a low level mission for relics and forgot to change it to friends only. 2 MR 5s joined, G3 spawned and they panicked. I told then to have a go and sat back and watched. They got stuck in to a prolonged firefight, one went down so I revived him and they eventually killed them although I couldn't stop my cat from destroying one of them lol. There's me thinking "G3 really?" But to them it was a massive challenge. We simply outgrew that challenge the same way many of these people will eventually outgrow Wolf.

[-CdG-Zilchy]

4 minutes ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Last mission Hydron extract was at wave 10: MR 18, equinox p. L10; Dex furis L26. 

MR 21 Valkyr p. L30 multiple weapons L30 one at L25. 

MR 20 Valkyr L26 single weapon rank 0 not even a sentinel or companion. 

Myself. MR 16. Did over 50% of the damage and 46% of kills. A substantial number of my kills were with a primary with a build I messed up, to give gas damage for the daily. 

I don't know what figures exist, but anecdotally, I see many above my rank. 

I'm MR 27 but yeh the amount of players above MR 22 or so that come into hydron expecting to be carried is disgusting. Gimme back Draco where 4 players had to contribute or fail the mission or in a dedicated setup there is an agreed upon DPS farming focus.

[nslay]

6 hours ago, LSG501 said:

drop table/rates

You know, his drop rates for parts is pretty high... something like 35% chance to drop a part. But because he appears so infrequently, the drop rates seem far worse than they are! Yeah, so someone didn't get a part in 5 appearances of Wolf over 7 weeks. There's a ~12% chance that happens! That's within the realm of belief!

I think the root of the problem is really how infrequently he appears.

[ZedrinBot]

I've been making sure to always have a solid weapon equipped when running missions because of Wolf spawns. I have a Rattleguts kitgun with a riven that I mostly use.

Doing a void relic, the Wolf spawns in at level 70, and it still takes us 20 minutes to kill so we can get a Burning Wasp mod.

This is ridiculous. It's not difficult, it's not engaging, it's utterly stupid and is just tedious. Shooting a single target and occasionally rolling to the side for 20 minutes is not difficult, it's just not fun, at all. He's immune to status and can't be targeted by abilities so you can only rely on your guns and self buffs. If you don't have those, good luck. Even with good weapons, it still took 20 minutes and like 16 ammo pizzas to beat him.

I could've sworn there were patch notes that mentioned recalibrating scaling for assassins / invaders like the Wolf, but I guess it was just BS.

I'm fine with the idea behind Nightwave, moving significant rewards off of random rotations, but with how it's implemented the Wolf has just been a frustrating cherry on top of a very disappointing cake.

Edited April 30, 2019 by ZedrinBot

[Xaero]

Find something more useful?

Even my corrosive+blast Chromatic Blade build (which is far from optimal) takes lv70 Wolf down in about 1-2 minutes.

[AriaSTG]

As i feared, The Woof had planted the seed of hatred on our community. Not like this, I did not asks for our glorious community to argue with each other. We must subdue this epidemic by sending The Woof to Jupiter, Gas City might be a proper prison for notorious crimes he commited.

#SubdueTheHate
#RestrainWoof

[ZedrinBot]

12 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

Find something more useful?

Even my corrosive+blast Chromatic Blade build (which is far from optimal) takes lv70 Wolf down in about 1-2 minutes.

I'm pretty sure you're BSing.

Either that or you're solo. His health scales with the number of party members and something in the scaling seems to be broken.

For a comparison, my kitgun can destroy a dropship with a single magazine in level 50 Fortuna bounties, and it's rad/corrosive. For the recent level 70 Wolf, it only did about 188 damage a shot.

Either that or you weren't fighting him at level 70.

Edited April 30, 2019 by ZedrinBot

[Xaero]

3 minutes ago, ZedrinBot said:

I'm pretty sure you're BSing.

Either that or you're solo. His health scales with the number of party members and something in the scaling seems to be broken.

For a comparison, my kitgun can destroy a dropship with a single magazine in level 50 Fortuna bounties, and it's rad/corrosive. For the recent level 70 Wolf, it only did about 188 damage a shot.

I've met lv70 Wolf twice, and both times I had a random squad of people who were like "we can't beat him, let's not even try".

I'm using a little trick though. My mouse has an option to unlock the wheel so I can spin it fast just with a single swipe. And I've got melee attack bound to mouse wheel. And I have Berserker + Primed Fury on my EB. Imagine how fast the combo counter is going up.

[ZedrinBot]

6 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

I've met lv70 Wolf twice, and both times I had a random squad of people who were like "we can't beat him, let's not even try".

I'm using a little trick though. My mouse has an option to unlock the wheel so I can spin it fast just with a single swipe. And I've got melee attack bound to mouse wheel. And I have Berserker + Primed Fury on my EB. Imagine how fast the combo counter is going up.

So basically the only way to reliably beat wolf is to use melee. (and potentially a macro)

Which sucks design wise because it kinda shoehorns you into making sure you have good melee weapon equipped for the event, and sucks if you wanted to actually level a melee weapon. And you gotta make sure you have a frame that can actually survive him at melee range.

And an interesting note on that, considering the proposed plans for Melee 3.0 to cap the combo counter, that wouldn't be a viable option if 3.0 had dropped before the Wolf released.

DE should not be balancing the game around fringe cases like that.

Edited April 30, 2019 by ZedrinBot

[Xaero]

1 minute ago, ZedrinBot said:

So basically the only way to reliably beat wolf is to use melee.

Which sucks design wise because it kinda shoehorns you into making sure you have good melee weapon equipped for the event, and sucks if you wanted to actually level a melee weapon. And you gotta make sure you have a frame that can actually survive him at melee range.

Well, that's true. DE could introduce weak points for gun users like they did with Nox.

4 minutes ago, ZedrinBot said:

And an interesting note on that, considering the proposed plans for Melee 3.0 to cap the combo counter, that wouldn't be a viable option if 3.0 had dropped before the Wolf released.

It's unknown how the capped combo counter will be compensated, but if EB basic combo and attack speed remain untouched, it will still be a pretty quick fight.

[Test-995]

Exalted blade is one of a strongest melee, so no wonder that you easily destroyed him.

1-2 minutes with EB is usually counts as "extremely tanky".

[ZedrinBot]

4 minutes ago, Ksaero said:

Well, that's true. DE could introduce weak points for gun users like they did with Nox

This would be a good idea. Maybe also some moves / behavior changes when he gets lower on health. As is he's an incredibly boring bullet sponge (for anyone other than Excalibur or Valkyr evidently and again designing and balancing an encounter for a SINGLE COMBINATION or two is dumb.)

[THeMooN85]

[bibmobello]

20 minutes?!?!?!?! WTF! 

4 minutes ago, ZedrinBot said:

This would be a good idea. Maybe also some moves / behavior changes when he gets lower on health. As is he's an incredibly boring bullet sponge (for anyone other than Excalibur or Valkyr evidently and again designing and balancing an encounter for a SINGLE COMBINATION or two is dumb.)

You only need a decent heavy radiation weapon. Alone he dies pretty fast but if you have a squad of hobos using  slingshots then can become pretty boring...

Edited April 30, 2019 by bibmobello

[JaycemeSwain]

So you didn't have rubico prime modded for rad and crit so now you're whining he is too hard? git gud

I 3 shot him easily with that and I'm using hildryn, so no buff to keep help the damage of the rubico

[Jiminez_Burial]

36 minutes ago, ZedrinBot said:

I'm pretty sure you're BSing.

Either that or you're solo. His health scales with the number of party members and something in the scaling seems to be broken.

For a comparison, my kitgun can destroy a dropship with a single magazine in level 50 Fortuna bounties, and it's rad/corrosive. For the recent level 70 Wolf, it only did about 188 damage a shot.

Either that or you weren't fighting him at level 70.

Things can kill him fast.  I can show a video of my friend with SI Valkyr killing him in 5 seconds at Hydron lvl.

[bibmobello]

4 minutes ago, Jiminez_Burial said:

Things can kill him fast.  I can show a video of my friend with SI Valkyr killing him in 5 seconds at Hydron lvl.

My farts can kill him faster....

We are speaking about people with low level equipment and low ML and BTW he appears everytime you don't have your full modded Lanka or  when you wanna ML your level 0 AMphis...

Edited April 30, 2019 by bibmobello