Operators: The improvements the tenno needs

[Andraker]

hace 5 horas, CephalonCarnage dijo:

What needs to happen is for DE to recognise that this is Warframe, not "we're bored with warframe lets make somethingelse frame"..

I'd have thought the Kahl missions would have hammered this into their skulls. We don't like this not-warframe play, We really don't like awful movement, being one-shot by enemies, (even dragons) and I'm not sure anyone really likes drifter and this multiverse lore that mocks WF more than anything.

Speak for yourself.

[quxier]

On 2022-10-19 at 8:05 AM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

Mobility

The biggest offence here is the sprint speed being too slow which is one of the reasons why I don`t like the dr , they move even slower than the op and why many ppl don`t enjoy playing as the dr or the op, seeing it in the Duviri gameplay was so unbearable. I`d say about 50% more sprint speed and both op and dr need to have the same sprint speed.

If they buff sprint then probably lots of section would be much easier. If it's outside quest then I guess it's ok.

On 2022-10-19 at 8:05 AM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

Sentinels are invulnerable when playing them.

All companions.

Or just make all of them immortal all of the time. Babysitting is not good. They can make e.g. 2 companions:

- 1 for helping -> immortal, healing, hacking, defense etc

- 1 for attack -> shooting & stuffs.

On 2022-10-19 at 8:05 AM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

• If you have vacuum mod on your sentinel or companion and you are in your operator form, the operator should be able to pick up items.

Why Sentinel just hover over frame taking hits?! It's insane. Just let it follow us (Operator).

On 2022-10-19 at 8:05 AM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

You should be able to use them in the relays.

Spoilers so no.

On 2022-10-19 at 8:05 AM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

Here are a list of things that needs to happen before the quest comes out:

Most of those things doesn't have to happen. To be honest I don't care if they look bad. I had to play it not look at stuffs.

[(XBOX)Doragonzuk]

21 hours ago, quxier said:

Spoilers so no.

Not really they could implement it the way they do with the open world hubs where if you haven't completed the quest's yet then the operators don't appear

[(PSN)Vexx757]

Here are a list of things that needs to happen before the quest comes out:

@[DE]Rebecca @[DE]Megan @[DE]Pablo

 

Mobility

The biggest offence here is the sprint speed being too slow which is one of the reasons why I don`t like the dr , they move even slower than the op and why many ppl don`t enjoy playing as the dr or the op, seeing it in the Duviri gameplay was so unbearable. I`d say about 50% more sprint speed and both op and dr need to have the same sprint speed.

 

Slow unbearable sprint speed.

Spoiler

 

 

Much better sprint speed.

Spoiler

 

 

They also need better mobility to traverse the environment like:

• A vertical wall hop.
• More consistent edge grab with a consistently working vault mechanic (enemy vaulting).
• Running on ziplines consistently (The op needs this too).

 

Animations

Another reason why I don`t like playing them is coz the animations look weird, they took the animations from warframes and put them on the dr.

To make them feel different to warframes, they need to have different animations.

The sprint animation on the dr looks weird, the reason for it coz they are moving too slow that kind of running animation is meant to be for something moving really fast, that’s why it looks weird when someone dose the Naruto run or sonic run coz it doesn’t visually match the speed. However, look at the difference just by increasing the sprint speed.

Spoiler

 

 

The sprint animation on the dr looks weird, the reason for it coz they are moving too slow that kind of running animation is meant to be for something moving really fast, that’s why it looks weird when someone dose the Naruto run or running like Sonic coz it doesn’t visually match the speed, they also need to have a better walking animation, it makes them look stiff and robotic.

Here are some other things I would like for them to be improved on:

Spoiler

The sprint of the dr needs to visually change, her back needs to be striate like the op is.

When the dr is walking and jogging, she has two hands on the gun, the closest thing I can think of is like Jill in Resident Evil revelations, to me it makes it look like she is trained in fire arms. Also, if the dr ever gets a rifle the animation needs to be different also.

 

The jumping animation need to be different for the dr, her back is striate, one leg up bent and one leg down a bit also bent, arms can stay the same (maybe).

 

They also need facial animations to make them look more human and Idle animations to give them personality (both dr and op can use them).

 

Bug fixes, QOL Improvements & Additions

Besides the dr, the op need them also. If anyone has any bugs they know of or ideas of QOL improvements please add them here.

 

• There is a delay between pressing the button and operator crouching.
• Companion mods like animal instinct should work while in operator form not just warframes.
• Include the A, B & C slots for amps to give option to change amps, colours, equip arcanes and lenses.
• Include the ability to change the face of the operators in the slots of A, B & C.
• They both can ride on K-drives.
• The hair of the dreads and the tied-up plats are not attached to the hairline.

Spoiler

• You can change their visuals, focus trees and amps while in the simulacrum.
• Give us the ability to customise the them in captura.
• Add an in-depth face customisation (nose length, eye width etc) and separate body sliders to change the length, width and height of the operators.
• Add different voices for them (from different ethnicities) and have a slider to manipulate the sound to make it unique to your operator.
• Sentinels are invulnerable when playing them.
• If you extract with them, you will see them getting onto the ship.
• You can open lockers and switch to synthesis scanner while moving.
• If you have vacuum mod on your sentinel or companion and you are in your operator form, the operator should be able to pick up items.
• The judicial coils ear pieces are attached to their chin instead of the back of the neck like it`s support to.

Spoiler

• You should be able to use them in the relays.
• Make the cursor more visible on amps.
• When switching to the synthesis scanner the Sirocco amp doesn’t fold away when using op and the dr still has it in their hand. What should happed is the dr should have it attached to the leg like warframes do.

Spoiler

• Make operators be able to use all emotes.
• Give the ability to switch to scanner while running.
• Remove the long delay between doing a hard landing and when you start moving again.
• Make it where you are able to view the emotes while using the dr and op on the menu screen.
• Remove knockdown from amps and use the knockdown system for when they receive it from enemies.

 

 

 What I would like to see in the Duviri Update.

 

• Since the Dr are getting melee, I would like to see op get them as well (void melee). If I was going to present an idea of how op melee would work here is what I would do

Spoiler

·       The melee weapons that operators use are made up of void energy, they can summon it from within themselves (visually like excel 4th ability).

·       Since it`s pure void energy, the colour is based on the operators energy colour.

·       Void weapons will work the same way as normal melee weapons. (option)

·       The weapons have their own stance however you can also use existing stance mods on them.

·       blocking incoming damage to give them survivability by giving operators 90% damage reduction.

·       Void damage will be included with the other stats.

·       When attacking an enemy, any bullets that stray near the enemy your attacking will reflect the damage back at the enemy that fired them. (the opposite to bullet attractor)

·       Using void weapons will use the same button as the one using void blast. To use void melee, you have to hold the button.

·       If the operators have their void melee weapon equipped while transferring into the warframe, the operator will have it equipped still when transferring out.

·       Operator can preform melee finishers while in void mode.

·       Since this does mostly void damage, they are highly effective against sentient enemies.

 

However to not make it similar to warframes here are some differences.

·       In the equipment section you will have void melee, when selected there will be a slot (for the stance).

·       The mod could represent the operator`s memory of the weapon he/she wants.

·       If you choose a sword, you have the option to choose stances from the other stances that you can customise, for example, for a void sword, you can take stances from iron phoenix, crimson dervish, vengeful revenant and swooping falcon.

Spoiler

 

·       The button presses can be like hack and slash games like DMC, GOW and Bayonetta. (Square x2, hold square, square x4 or square x2, pause square x4)

·       Operator can lift a enemy in the air by holding melee button where the operator can do aerial attacks.

·       Instead of a slide attack, the operator will charge their weapon forward doing critical damage to enemies while adding a small ragdol.

·       Visually, heavy attacks are the operator thrusting their weapon into the ground making enemies suspended in the air for 7 seconds.

·       The mechanics by using melee on operators can be based on skill rather than just mindless button mashing like warframes.

·       Void melee can deal with sentient and eximus enemies efficiently.

 

You can use any melee weapon with the operators, however, using a certain weapon will give bonus stats for the weapon and the operator based on the focus tree you use it on.

Examples

Madurai:

Spoiler

Signature weapons:

Swords, Duel swords, Tonfa, Fists, Sparring & Claws.

 

Bonuses:

Preforming aerial attacks will send out an energy wave that has a 70% chance for enemies to burst into flames.

Operator receives 70% resistance to status effects.

·       Void melee weapons will benefit from phoenix talons, phoenix spirit and void strike.

·       The energy wave from aerial attacks will benefit from void strike and phoenix spirit

·       If enemies don`t burst into flames from the fire wave, it will do void damage instead.

·       The energy wave will only benefit from void and status damage.

·       The wave can reach up to 10m with an 8m radius.

·       Energy waves has damage fall-off.

·       Can trigger stealth damage bonuses.

·       Can headshot enemies.

 

Naramon:

Signature weapons:

Swords, Duel swords, Daggers, Duel daggers, Glaives, Sparring & Claws.

 

Bonuses:

While blocking, enemies attacks will be reflected at them, breaking their defences, making them more susceptible to damage by 50% for 10 seconds.

Operator receives 30% running speed.

·       Void melee weapons will benefit from affinity spike, power spike, void stalker & executing dash.

·       Enemies vulnerable from reflected attacks will be dealt more damage from using surging dash.

·       Reflected attacks will instantly affect the enemies.

·       Reflecting attacks from enemies will have a 60% chance to stagger them.

·       The stagger will last two seconds.

·       Enemies being weaker to damage cannot stack with multiple uses however then stagger can be used again however, the chance of the proc is reduced to 40%.

·       Affected enemies will have a mark above them to indicate which enemies are weakened. Mark colour is determined by operator`s energy colour.

·       Warframe and weapon damage can take advantage of this.

·       Using this on sentients will permanently strip them of their invulnerability and can be killed easily.

·       The extra 30% running speed will stack with mind step.

 

This is something that warframes were meant to get but I think it would be better if operator got this ability.

Spoiler

Void Rage

Void weapons have a gauge that can be filled up by killing enemies. When this happens, the operator is in a powerful state that increases melee damage, attack speed, sprint speed and amplify weapon bonuses.

·       Void rage will last one minute.

·       Upon activation, operator will scream in rage surrounded by an aura (operator`s energy colour)

Visually the weapon is broken, then as the operator kills enemies it start to become whole and when it does you can activate void rage.

 

Just imagine if this was a thing..

Spoiler

 

 

• I would like to see op only missions, there could be a game-mode where you play as the Dr or Op and your using melee only to fight.

 

Evolving Amps

On devstream 160, they talked about evolving weapons and they showed the Sirocco amp which was just a placeholder however, why stop there? that is a good idea, why not have amps that can evolve and change the way it fires plus the appearance it changes into could be a skin for the amp or better yet it could be a skin that can be used on any amp.

I also think the sirocco needs this treatment since performance wise it is mediocre compared to the other amps.

Spoiler

https://forums.warframe.com/topic/1299887-spoiler-sirocco-amp-problems-improvements/

 

Differences Between Op and Dr Gameplay

I think the Dr should play differently to the op.

Here are some examples of abilities they could have:

Spoiler

·       Seeker bombs that send out an emp that disarms enemies and electrocute them.

 

·       A sentinel that helps the Drifter and attacks enemies.

 

·       Sends out a pulse that can see enemies through walls.

 

·       A grappling hook that can pull her to surfaces, drag enemies close to her and can be used as a zipline (the drifters is what should have this not the operators).

 

·       She can have special foot wear that can make the drifter run faster, jump higher and further.

 

·       A smoke bomb that does toxin/true damage while concealing her location for a short duration.

 

This provides two options of game-play between Operator and Drifter, one used void abilities while the other relies on tech and physical abilities.

 

I would like to see more Dr and Op outfits like this for example.

Spoiler

 

Edited October 26, 2022 by (PSN)Vexx757

[Myscho]

Less game-breaking bugs

[Pakaku]

I want the new grind to be streamlined and less repetitive, even though I know I should expect the opposite.

New weapons would be nice, something that is more than just yet another uninspired melee weapon.

Maybe more Operator and amp arcane slots, a fuller selection, and getting Drifter's original ability set again

[quxier]

Cool melee combat, horse being nice mechanics and usable outside Duviri or other open worlds. We need some new mechanic for OP from Duviri. Something that would make Drifter/OP more fun to play.

21 minutes ago, Pakaku said:

New weapons would be nice, something that is more than just yet another uninspired melee weapon.

Yeah. We will probably have double nikana but I wish it will something more than proper weapon like Heavy scythe (Hespar).

 

[--END--Rikutatis]

Great story and atmosphere. I'll be happy enough with that.

I have a feeling gameplay might be hit or miss for many people, since not everyone enjoy playing as the operator for extended periods. 

[(PSN)Vexx757]

Vexx-info: Can we operator outfits that look similar to these designs?

There are some outfits I have seen that I would be cool if the operator wore something similar to.

Here are some I would like for them to get:

Spoiler

 

 And I know @LestryusYggdrus would want something like this.

Spoiler

 

And imagine if we had and outfit that looked like this, please let us have this in the Duviri update.

Spoiler

 

Edited October 25, 2022 by (PSN)Vexx757

[LuckyCharm]

A reason to use the stuff it brings with it. If it just hands us more power for the sake of it then wheres the thing we're supposed to use it on. Grinds gotta be for a reason else its just one more content island

[tel__arin]

Operator/drifter arsenal

[(XBOX)ExpensiveYNo]

I want a Dax inspired frame, cool weapons that have a special feature like how the incarnon weapons can evolve and, face options for the operator and drifter that don't make them look like the result of 10 generations of inbreeding

 

[(PSN)GEN-Son_17]

I want to see players and content creators NOT SPOILING THE UPDATE. I want to be surprised, immersed, adventurous and held within mystery as I journey through whatever Duviri brings. People spoil everything and ruin experiences way too often nowadays. 

[quxier]

1 hour ago, (PSN)GEN-Son_17 said:

I want to see players and content creators NOT SPOILING THE UPDATE. I want to be surprised, immersed, adventurous and held within mystery as I journey through whatever Duviri brings. People spoil everything and ruin experiences way too often nowadays. 

If you don't want get any spoilers then don't even open browser. I bet there would be some spoilers when you are watching "cute cat pictures" (joke).

My rule of thumb  is to finish something then go over internet for more info or chat. I even avoid reading episode's discussion.

[MutoManiac]

A flying motorcycle like machine with a rocket engine and mounted guns instead of a horse. 🙂

[LSG501]

Lets see....

No use of the operator... oh wait that's not happening...

Hopefully it will be 'faster' and more fun than the other operator missions we've had... I hate the operator only quests with a passion

No excessive grind... hmm....  I won't hold my breath on this one

No unnecessary repetitiveness.... not holding out much hope here either.

 

Honestly I'm not looking forward to the duviri paradox because based on what we've seen so far it going to be very heavy on the parts of the game I don't like...

[(PSN)slightconfuzzled]

EDIT: Original thread was more along the lines of what you want, now its what "needs" to happen, below is answering the original premise. 

I usually try keep my expectations low. Seeing as we might be playing a bit more Operator/Drifter, though, some more Amp parts, Amp Arcanes, and Operator/Drifter Arcanes, Fashion, Accessories, and tools might be nice. 

As with most updates, I really like it when we get a significant amount of new weapons. I have grown to like the Felarx, but I'd still really get hyped for another Incarnon Shotgun type weapon. Especially if it was a smaller magazine/more damage. Not really a fan of Felarx type reloading. Do really like the aesthetic of Duviri though, so any cool new weapons that might tie in to it, would be welcome. 

Some new Focus School nodes. Maybe a buff of sorts to Vaz. 

Edited October 26, 2022 by (PSN)slightconfuzzled
OP changed thread title.

[vanaukas]

Operator melee and expansion of operator abilities, hopefully new amps and arcanes as well. 

At this point I don't know what to expect besides that looks absolutely beutiful and I'll see Teshin again, I'm really happy about that.

[Vaml77]

I hope it's not another sindicate and that it prioritizes random events...this formula its outdated and I hope to see some innovation.

Enough of sindicates DE?

[(PSN)Mighty_Keljoran]

I would like them to not add another terrible movement system into the game. We already have jetpacks I don't want to touch that terrible ugly horse. Also why more content that makes you not play as your frame. Your game is called Warframe not Operater. How about some support for archwings to make them less terrible. How about some more mods and choices for k-drive to make it better. How about more Railjack content that pulls people into that. But no instead we get another faction to grind for. I can not stress how horrible I think adding a slow moving horse is to the game.

[quxier]

On 2022-10-25 at 1:23 AM, (PSN)Vexx757 said:

Differences Between Op and Dr Gameplay

I think the Dr should play differently to the op.

I don't think Operator & Drifter should have different gameplay. I would rather those options (rolls, speed, powers etc) be selectable.

Forcing us to one kind of gameplay while we have OP-only & Dr-only clothes/attachment is not right.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

Echoes of Veilbreaker needs to happen first, but beyond that:

- a substantial amount of bug testing to ensure that Duviri isn't a bug fest: we should only be saying WTF at pivotal story moments, not because we got stuck in a wall or one of the horses is flying.

- the overall story needs to be put in the proper chronological order, and maybe bring events back as quests for players who didn't get the chance to experience them.

- modular Archwing and Necramech in normal missions: is this happening or not? being silent isn't going to make this question go away DE, we need a definitive answer one way or the other.

- infested Railjack/lich system: could we at least get word on this?

- 3rd orb mother fight: no, I haven't forgotten about this. still waiting DE..

chances are none of these are happening of course, so the most reasonable thing any of us can wish for is that Duviri won't be a total grindfest and maybe we'll also get a good story and a banging soundtrack. those would be enough for me. 

[(PSN)Zero_029]

Sprint speed wise and mobility wise I feel that the Op/Dr are perfectly fine.

They aren't Warframes so alot of the Warframe Parkour shouldn't be possible impo.

We're void empowered so I'd 100% be down for a brief Wall Run and maybe a limited number of Wall kicks. 

But sprint speed (I have issues with Kahl not getting tired for example), they should be slower than Warframes, and honestly (I know this'll trigger people) they should have stamina when running and doing parkour. Same for Kahl. 

These aren't Super Powered Infested bio-machines.

2 hours ago, quxier said:

I don't think Operator & Drifter should have different gameplay. I would rather those options (rolls, speed, powers etc) be selectable.

Forcing us to one kind of gameplay while we have OP-only & Dr-only clothes/attachment is not right.

^^^^ 100x this. 

I would love for Op/Dr to have options, as well as for Dr to have the Focus Stance animations.

I 100% agree that Operator needs melee. The clunky Warframe teleport crap is just that....crap.

You and I are just about 100% allied on that topic.

As for Drifter playing completely different?

I have to respectfully disagree. As it will end with players being unhappy and feeling "forced" to play a specific character as ultimately one will end up being better than the other.

Considering The Operator has Void powers (which Drifter now has due to the story of TNW and must have in order for them to pilot Warframes) thr Operator would end up being the "Meta" choice and fans of The Drifter will feel slighted/bamboozled/upset. 

[Raarsi]

I'd like actual Warframe gameplay on warframes and not anything we actually saw from the Duviri stuff.

Either that or rename the game "Person Riding Horse-like Thing".

[(PSN)Vexx757]

21 hours ago, (PSN)Zero_029 said:

But sprint speed (I have issues with Kahl not getting tired for example), they should be slower than Warframes, and honestly (I know this'll trigger people) they should have stamina when running and doing parkour. Same for Kahl. 

These aren't Super Powered Infested bio-machines.

I have talked about this before about the dumb comments about making it make sense, idc if it makes sense I care about if it`s practical and the mobility of them are not which is one of the reasons why ppl don`t like them. If you didn`t know wf`s use to have stamina bars but ppl didn`t like it so DE removed it so that is not coming back (which I am glad for).

I`m not saying they should be just like warframes but they need decent mobility where they can travers around instead of just using void grapple al the time, so I will keep pushing for them to get better mobility.

Besides this is a futuristic game and with DE introducing eternalisim, anything is possible so I don`t see them getting better mobility an issue and I welcome it.