Thoughts about Galvanized Mods and Berserker mod?

[vegetosayajin]

3 minutes ago, Jarriaga said:

I think this is a misunderstanding. Reb meant to say that at 3 stacks, nerfed CO will match the value it currently has at 2. No cap, just lower buff value.

From the post:
 

Quote

We’ve reduced this to 80% to make it almost as good as Primed Pressure Point, and 3 Status Types back to where it was originally

I really hope it's bad wording.
If The 3 status cap is just a misunderstanding the melee meta will be as powerful as before.
If not...then they just killed the game for a lot of players that want to go on high levels without exploiting frost bubble true damage etc.

[Jarriaga]

Just now, vegetosayajin said:

From the post:
 

I really hope it's bad wording.
If The 3 status cap is just a misunderstanding the melee meta will be as powerful as before.
If not...then they just killed the game for a lot of players that want to go on high levels without exploiting frost bubble true damage etc.

Again:  From that I got that at 3 status (240) you'll get back to what you currently have at 2 status (240). I understand it means more effort from that wording and no cap indication or implication from there. 

[Danielw8]

2 minutes ago, vegetosayajin said:

From the post:
 

I really hope it's bad wording.
If The 3 status cap is just a misunderstanding the melee meta will be as powerful as before.
If not...then they just killed the game for a lot of players that want to go on high levels without exploiting frost bubble true damage etc.

Allways will be ways to kill lvlcap enemies doesnt matter what.

At this moment you not even need primed faction, you not even need min max builds, you can use viral in your melee and you still doing really good...

Probly after this update you will need buffs from your warframe, primed faction (take note baroo is giving primed faction in the last month or something), so resuming, if you actually want kill lvlcap enemies with your melee, you need min max your whole gear.

[(XBOX)GearsMatrix301]

6 hours ago, _Euphoria_ said:

Use arcane strike instead of Berserker Fury, problem solved

Problem not solved. We shouldn’t have to farm for days to get a strike set or spend platinum to buy a set just to get back the attack speed that was taken away.

[ReddyDisco]

49 minutes ago, vegetosayajin said:

From the post:
 

I really hope it's bad wording.
If The 3 status cap is just a misunderstanding the melee meta will be as powerful as before.
If not...then they just killed the game for a lot of players that want to go on high levels without exploiting frost bubble true damage etc.

i too hope its a just DE being bad at grammar.

buuuuut...just incase/if they did intended to nerf co to "unusability", i ran a sp survival with just ppp and reaper prime with epitaph primer, i frankly couldn't tell much of a difference, given i stayed for about 30min before i had to leave due to rl, i suppose it only makes a difference to endurance runners who sit in a mission for 8hrs+

[vegetosayajin]

4 minutes ago, ReddyDisco said:

it only makes a difference to endurance runners who sit in a mission for 8hrs+

3 hours in sp disruption and you will see a big difference ye, otherwise it doesn't make a big impact

[MqToasty]

1 hour ago, vegetosayajin said:

No, I said this is big but not AS BIG as the CO nerf, especially the max 3 stacks of statuses - that means that this equation

Total Damage = Base Damage × [1 + Damage Mods + (Condition Overload Multiplier × n)] × (1 + Elemental Mods)

will become essentially this

Total Damage = Base Damage × [1 + Damage Mods + (Condition Overload Multiplier × 3)] × (1 + Elemental Mods)

I don't remember the max cap on co with maximum status effects but it was somewhere in the realm of 16 status effects - that means 120x16=1920% melee damage(most of the time you get from 5-7 status so that's 840%)
Now it will be max 240% melee damage cap.
If it was only br nerfed...it's a bad but not as bad as so much damage lost from co imo.

That could be -- I don't usually see more than 3 or 4 status procs on my targets before they drop, but I agree 240% is a drastically lower cap for CO.  Well I guess we'll have to wait for the nerf to drop to see just how bad it all becomes...

[MonsterOfMyOwn]

il y a 58 minutes, MqToasty a dit :

That could be -- I don't usually see more than 3 or 4 status procs on my targets before they drop, but I agree 240% is a drastically lower cap for CO.  Well I guess we'll have to wait for the nerf to drop to see just how bad it all becomes...

Try the cedo with 2 combined status and use alt fire. 7 status in AoE bouncing between ennemies, then melee them.

At least try it before the nerf.

[Tiltskillet]

2 hours ago, Jarriaga said:

Again:  From that I got that at 3 status (240) you'll get back to what you currently have at 2 status (240). I understand it means more effort from that wording and no cap indication or implication from there. 

That's a very reasonable interpretation.  However...

. . . and 3 Status Types back to where it was originally.

I'll point out that "originally" the 2019 CO nerf  was going to involve a cap of three status types.  

It's probably just a  coincidence and and odd, unfortunate wording on Reb's part...but I hope that gets  settled tomorrow.

[MqToasty]

26 minutes ago, MonsterOfMyOwn said:

Try the cedo with 2 combined status and use alt fire. 7 status in AoE bouncing between ennemies, then melee them.

At least try it before the nerf.

Oh I love the Cedo!  I just tend to focus on higher Viral, Bleed and Heat stacks, so I end up with less variety and thus less benefit from Condition Overload itself.  Which 7 elements do you mod for, though, and how do you distribute them between your Cedo and your other weapons?

[MonsterOfMyOwn]

il y a 2 minutes, MqToasty a dit :

Oh I love the Cedo!  I just tend to focus on higher Viral, Bleed and Heat stacks, so I end up with less variety and thus less benefit from Condition Overload itself.  Which 7 elements do you mod for, though, and how do you distribute them between your Cedo and your other weapons?

Rad viral on the cedo, no use of secondary, slash on melee.

The cedo was a great utility weapon : debuff and control with the alt fire (rad viral) + crapload of bonus for condition overload, and primary fire is great at depopping nullies bubbles.

After the patch I think that I'll still use it with Lavos (if they don't nerf the damage stacking of his 4th with status)

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

Some of them are good some of them are bad.     Its just bullcrap we have to screw with steel path to get the crap.   

I DO NOT WANT TO PLAY HARD MODE.  

[MonsterOfMyOwn]

il y a 7 minutes, (PSN)AbBaNdOn_ a dit :

I DO NOT WANT TO PLAY HARD MODE.  

Hard mode is not that hard, tbh I spend a lot of my playtime in steelpath mot.

I rather play SP Mot than running nuke gauss 3rd in relic exterminate, spamming relic capture, waiting for the tridolon, or cheesing the dumb riven challenges.

[(PSN)AbBaNdOn_]

17 minutes ago, MonsterOfMyOwn said:

Hard mode is not that hard, tbh I spend a lot of my playtime in steelpath mot.

I rather play SP Mot than running nuke gauss 3rd in relic exterminate, spamming relic capture, waiting for the tridolon, or cheesing the dumb riven challenges.

That is super interesting.

[(XBOX)Knight Raime]

I really don't care for any of the melee nerfs.  The only tangible effect happening here is that berzerker is being removed as a mod.  People will still stack attack speed buffs because there's plenty of sources that let you do so that are just as easy to access.  Blood rush is still going to be powerful and not dropped or replaced by anything.  And CO will continue to remain situational entirely dependent on if you run a primer or not.  I'm just miffed at the angle of approach here.  It also feels pretty silly to state melee weapons don't have variety compared to guns when I've always felt melee weapons were more varied and expressive compared to guns.

With guns it feels like I either take an AoE weapon for most content or a gun that can delete problematic enemies.  I'll just touch on it here to save from repeating myself regarding the mods but regardless of how powerful guns will be Warframe's general gameplay doesn't push me to swap between weapons.  Some of this is the fault of weapons themselves but mainly it's just how brain dead combat is in WF.  The meaningful choice with guns has always been if it can flatline an enemy(s) in 1-2 shots.  Until you've got all the best mods it's only about which option you have does the most damage.  If they want me to use something besides melee 90% of the time than make combat more interactive.  (Also it wouldn't hurt if you made guns feel more satisfying to use from a sensory feedback perspective.)

 

Far as the new mods go DE did a fantastic job with their effects.  Considering we'll be able to replace thinks like sarration and hornet strike through the usage of weapon arcanes the cost of them isn't bothering me.  What bothers me is that DE still releases weapons with little to no polarity slots.  For players who don't dump all their time into WF guns end up being a higher investment than melee tends to be.  Making guns more worthwhile to use is good.  But it's not going to replace a melee for me when I don't need to invest my house to get something out of my melee weapon.  I also don't agree with making them only available from steel path.  If you can already do steel path you don't really need these mods.  But that's more of a nitpick from me.

[Aldain]

32 minutes ago, (XBOX)Knight Raime said:

Considering we'll be able to replace thinks like sarration and hornet strike through the usage of weapon arcanes the cost of them isn't bothering me.

...The Arcanes only Activate On Kill and need to stack at least 5-6 times to match base damage mods, removing base damage mods and trying to replace them with an Arcane will not work like you think it will.

Removing base damage mods will also effect how elemental mods will scale because elemental mods go off the adjusted base damage from mods like Hornet Strike/Serration.

With how DE designed them those Arcanes are made to be used in conjunction with base damage mods, not as a replacement.

[KlaussKlauss]

Guys, you are wasting time on assumptions here. You should go back to the grind. 

Who cares about melee? We need more content islands, rng fodder drops and one week random buffs from helminth the loot box patch work system. 

Stop wasting time on forum and go buy rivens for your grind stick!

[(PSN)thowed]

Can Wukong also get some kind of changes?  He's clearly over used in every game mode and is the only frame I see one or more in every match.  We gotta have diversity so get to his nerfs.

[TARINunit9]

11 hours ago, Guderirian said:

        1. Still, kills as triggering condition isn't that fair for weapons with low stock damage and dps. The only types weapons that could trigger these effects with efficiency are AOE weapons, shotguns and snipers, and there would be less space for SMGs and ARs to take advantage of these mods. Players would not like emptying their smg's magazine over and over again just for triggering the Galvanized effects. Changing the triggering condition from kill to crit damage would be more friendlier for AR and SMG users, and unpopular guns would start to appear in players' load outs.

        2. There's another triggering condition that would make most players sad is Head-shot kills. Not everyone has that precision and if they do, all the Warframe players should take part in CS-GO pro-league. On the other hand, taking head shots on every mob in Exterminate missions would be boring and tired. We need to find better solutions for Galvanized mods to make it friendly and fun for everyone.

I agree with point 1, Galvanized mods look interesting but I don't think they will be enough

But on point 2, getting headshots isn't hard in most battles. The behaviour of your average Grineer or Crewman is to stand still and shoot you, not to twitch around like a human player

[SneakyErvin]

2 hours ago, Tiltskillet said:

That's a very reasonable interpretation.  However...

. . . and 3 Status Types back to where it was originally.

I'll point out that "originally" the 2019 CO nerf  was going to involve a cap of three status types.  

It's probably just a  coincidence and and odd, unfortunate wording on Reb's part...but I hope that gets  settled tomorrow.

No, originally it stacked up to 16-ish times and was multiplicative. Originally in this case can only refer to how it is on live currently since the other versions of CO are either not part of the game anymore or never made it in at all. So refering to something that never even left the idea state as original when it wasnt even part of the original mechanic would be extremely far fetched. Only those of us that read the idea back then can possibly know of it, while the rest of the playerbase doesnt.

 

[Tiltskillet]

19 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

No, originally it stacked up to 16-ish times and was multiplicative. Originally in this case can only refer to how it is on live currently since the other versions of CO are either not part of the game anymore or never made it in at all. So refering to something that never even left the idea state as original when it wasnt even part of the original mechanic would be extremely far fetched. Only those of us that read the idea back then can possibly know of it, while the rest of the playerbase doesnt.

 

Hey, for all I know DE might not know the three status cap never made it in, or has forgotten about it.   😄

[Jarriaga]

24 minutes ago, SneakyErvin said:

No, originally it stacked up to 16-ish times and was multiplicative. Originally in this case can only refer to how it is on live currently since the other versions of CO are either not part of the game anymore or never made it in at all. So refering to something that never even left the idea state as original when it wasnt even part of the original mechanic would be extremely far fetched. Only those of us that read the idea back then can possibly know of it, while the rest of the playerbase doesnt.

 

Indeed. This is why I don't think DE are implying there will be a 3-status cap as there was no cap originally, and there never has been. It's something they considered in the melee phase 2 revision workshop, but they didn't go through with this when the Old Blood launched. A non-implemented idea can not be the original state if it never made it through.

[syl42]

I really hope they will introduce new mods. Those Galvanized mods are just existing mods but better. It doesn't improve build diversity, we will just replace the old multishot mod by the new one.

Also, I wonder what's the point of Galvanized Aptitude (or any other damage mod) when the arcane will give 300% damage, this will completely overshadow raw damage. Maybe the new meta is to stack ele damage?

[Tyreaus]

I think the Berserker changes will trashbin the mod but I don't think it's a big deal. Primed Fury isn't too far off. It's unfortunate a mod is getting binned that hard but not a huge deal on the broad scheme of things.

The Galvanized mods miss the mark by five miles. The purpose behind the workshop was to bring primaries and secondaries closer to melee weapons. Yet they seem to have recognized what makes melees good (like Blood Rush) and done everything in their power to steer as far away from that while making it look like that. They have lower caps than their melee counterparts, require kills rather than hits, and heck, they don't even change the meta build for primaries and secondaries because they're upgrades of, and mutually exclusive with, existing mods. We could have had a simple carry-over of Blood Rush in a new mod that might shake up the meta some, but...we can't have that, I guess.

Not to mention that if the entire point is to make said weapons viable in Steel Path, locking them behind that same content probably isn't the greatest move.

[Aldain]

12 minutes ago, syl42 said:

Also, I wonder what's the point of Galvanized Aptitude (or any other damage mod) when the arcane will give 300% damage, this will completely overshadow raw damage. Maybe the new meta is to stack ele damage?

Because the Arcane Merciless requires kills to even start ramping up.

Elemental damage also is based upon the base damage of a weapon, which is modified by mods like Serration and Hornet Strike.