Empyrean and the decline of Warframe

[-T.BRIAREOS.T-]

I agree with you, they should have created a system of, crafte and exploration, new planets, new things that exist in the solar system, instead of repetitive combat, "go there, kill, complete goal and return". to remove combat  would be much better, would give a new life, diversity to the game.

[Tellakey]

13 hours ago, Hypernaut1 said:

At this point, it's not a Warframe problem, it's a you problem if you've been unsatisfied a dozen times. 

Devs aren't machines. Maybe they just aren't interested in repeating the same thing over and over. Maybe this is how they keep their juices flowing. 

Base game is FINE. if not, then why are you even here? Base game was fine years ago, that's why I'm still playing. I've played games that needed the base game improved. I didn't put in 1000+hrs on something that wasn't wholly satisfying.  If you did, that's a personal issue. 

Base game is horrible. Combat is a brain-dead press-4-2-win simulator. Difficulty and weapon damage are artificially fluffed with higher stats. Tile-sets involve little to know strategical timing or mobility. You move way too fast and enemies move way too slow. Too many enemies spawn, which detracts from the impact of the individual soldier and their potential threat. Some frames are outright invalid when compared to Saryn or Nidus. The same is true for weapons. Use Staticor/Plasmor if you want to be efficient, use anything else if you want to drag the game. Melee is pointless when gunplay takes care of most enemies faster and at long range.

And that's just being general. Warframe is boooooring. It needs a grounds-up rework to elementary mechanics. So why am I here? Three reasons. 1. Sunk cost fallacy. 2. False faith in DE to make it better eventually. 3. Story. In truth I hardly ever play the game anymore. Every time I take a long, long break, I get bored after a single mission. Railjack looks promising but I almost gave up on it because of the sheer amount of grind it takes just to build the damn thing.

So yea, I'd love new types of activities, and Railjack is pretty cool, conceptually, but please give it to me only after DE fixes that damn mess that is core gameplay.

 

Edited December 14, 2019 by Tellakey

[Skaleek]

16 hours ago, Awazx said:

What is Empyrean? It is Archwing 2.0. Nothing else

Yup and its a vast improvement from Archwing 1.0.

[PSvsXBOX]

16 hours ago, Awazx said:

After a year of drought of new content and after the questionable Lich system, Empyrean expected as a necessary breath of fresh air that Warframe desperately needed. How wrong I was.

What is Empyrean? It is Archwing 2.0. Nothing else. Did Archwing accept at the time? No, because this is Warframe. However, DE continues in its attempt to continue adding micro-games and game systems parallel to the main core (that Warframe-based core that made me fall in love with the game in 2014) and that does not contribute anything nor enrich the central experience of the game.

DE, you have spent 2 years of development at Empyrean. You could have spent that time creating a whole new solar system, with new planets, enemies and mysteries to discover. You could have improved and redesigned all the game systems that you have in the habit of leaving to action after its launch, from the syndicates to the focus system. You could have improved all the missions of the solar system and get it to play something other than defense and survival.

What do I have in place? The possibility of piloting a ship in an “open space” for 4 players, extinguishing fires and necessarily using my (forgotten) Archwing. Again, more grinding, more RNG, more new resources, more things disconnected from the true Warframe universe. For my part, I am not going to play Empyrean and I am not going to build my Railjack.

You are burning Warframe. You're burning faster than a Railjack burns under enemy fire.

I agree with you. It is a nice concept that DE tried to make, but the main problem of it is solo gameplay. Everyone knows that after some time there will be no people playing this after we got everything grinded for Empyrean, even now there is barely any people playing, even the recruit chat doesn't care about it. And the other problem is potato host, everything goes to hell when they leave, that is why many people like to stay solo gameplay just because of that. So yeah, totally agree with you, and DE needs to address Railjack for solo gameplay.

[LSG501]

1 hour ago, (PS4)RenovaKunumaru said:

FFS Why is this so hard for people to understand?
 

well with comments like yours it's understandable... I have no idea what your reply is meant to represent, does it support my comment, does it disagree with my comment.... I have no idea.

Either way I'm entitled to my viewpoint on the update, whatever your viewpoint is. 

[Hypernaut1]

22 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Base game is horrible.....

 

Your opinion on this game becomes invalid right here. If you don't like the base game, then your feedback is a waste of my time, your time and the devs. It's pretty much trolling.

I guess I'll never understand why people waste time on a game they apparently don't like. 

Edited December 14, 2019 by Hypernaut1

[ValinorAtani]

vor 53 Minuten schrieb HomicidalGrouse:

Congratulations, you're the reason DE doesn't even bother listening to the initial complaints about their releases...

And instead of trying to make me listen to opinions that aren't even your own... maybe you could try listening to mine. That opinion being that you and people like you should stop complaining about new content just because it isn't the content YOU want. You don't speak for everybody who plays this game.

We're in a thread filled with whiners making emotional arguments like "nobody wanted this!" and "I hate this grindy grinding!" and "this is just archwing 2.0! and everybody hates archwing!". These complaints aren't constructive in any way whatsoever. DE isn't just going to remove Railjack because you don't like it.

 

They're going to listen to constructive complaints, as they always have, and improve upon these news features whether you want to participate in them or not, so you may as well make yourself useful and start coming up with ways they could improve the content to actually get you to play it, rather than defending the complaints of people who have repeatedly said in this thread that they have no interest in playing it anyway.

Right now I’m not sure if your willing to understand what I wrote above.

I wrote what my first impression was. The first (my personal and only my personal) impression was that DE still has technical issues with their game. Plain Simple. First Missions doesn’t even work (cause technical reasons). So I won’t care about this mode.

If you want to projecting anything else into this. Do it. I won’t care.

The question now is why do you want me to return to the game and force me to play a mode that i wont care about? Why should I play the Quality Department of DE because they got so greedy with an Games Award Announcement instead of delay it till it works more or less for the players? My first impression of the gamemode is now gone to the wind because of this. That was my feedback to them. They had one chance. Didn’t work (again caused by their technical reasons) I won’t return and spending more money right now. Plain simple. If I’m just a statistical number within their feedback doesn’t matter.

Anyway they don’t even care about feedback anymore (even if it’s constructive and well reasonable). That’s just my external view from seeing the last dev stream and reading the lich, arbitration, Fortuna, melee etc etc suggestions and feedback on reddit and the forum. If you want me to blaim for that. Go ahead.

Just note that this situation of the game isn’t yours or mines. It’s DEs problem afterall. And if people will complain about the vision, future or whatever you just have to accept this even if you don’t agree about their opinions. That’s the definition of an discussion.

[LazyKnight]

24 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Base game is horrible. Combat is a brain-dead press-4-2-win simulator.

Base game is like the old Serious Sam games in the 3rd perspective. That's the core of the game, if DE wants to change it would take throwing out most of their core systems. 

[FoxyKabam]

26 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

I guess I'll never understand why people waste time on a game they apparently don't like.

I don't like warframe, but I don't hate it either.

I'm "wasting my time with it" because its very close to being something I could very much like.

[Tellakey]

49 minutes ago, Hypernaut1 said:

Your opinion on this game becomes invalid right here. If you don't like the base game, then your feedback is a waste of my time, your time and the devs. It's pretty much trolling.

I guess I'll never understand why people waste time on a game they apparently don't like. 

Excuse me? "If you don't have anything positive to say, then your opinion is invalid." Are you kidding me? So now disliking things is equated with trolling? God save us all from anti-critics.

Maybe I'm not a mindless drone who just slurps up everything I'm being spoon-fed with a $hit-eating grin. I used to like the base game but DE kinda gave up on it in favor of big expansions.

The game wasn't always in the horrible state it is today. Rivens weren't always a thing. Insane spawn rates weren't always a thing. Spasmodic parkour wasn't always a thing. Saryn wasn't always meta and Vauban used to be relevant.

I'm allowed to provide negative feedback on a game that used to adopt a certain direction that I liked and doesn't anymore. Imagine signing up for a literature club for it to slowly become a cinema club. This ain't what you signed for. Maybe you should just shut your mouth and accept this incoherent change. Don't be negative! Just shut up! What? You're kid is misbehaving? Well don't be a party-pooper. Just tell them how good they're being. We don't wanna be negative after all. You can't possibly love your kid while at the same time admonish them for their acting up, you bigot!

I won't be surprised if you're one of those people who say that people who disliked The Last Jedi are not real fans.

Edited December 14, 2019 by Tellakey

[Tellakey]

27 minutes ago, LazyKnight said:

Base game is like the old Serious Sam games in the 3rd perspective. That's the core of the game, if DE wants to change it would take throwing out most of their core systems. 

I don't know about throwing out, but it does need some serious tweaking of existing systems. Things that should be outright deleted are stuff like damage mods, rivens, etc... DE just isn't willing to make the sacrifice for the sake of quality.

Edited December 14, 2019 by Tellakey

[DerGreif2]

Warframe is a loot Shooter. WTF has Railjack to do with it? Nothing. I wait now a long time for new planets, bosses and such. Nothing. BUT now they wasted 2 years (and more in the future) in Archwing 2.0 that has nothing to do with the core of the game. Why people are pissed? Because they throw out the same thing archwing just with more micro management and a lot more bugs. Yes they will fix it but how long will that take? 1 month? 1 Year? And what will we get in the mean time?

Why do they even release new prime frames and weapons when we now got another mode where they are usless? I really wished that they would create a new system with missions, planets, and new bosses that also have new items to farm or frame to unlock all together with calssic quests... nope. Now we have waited a long time for archwing 2.0 and the new war that also has the focus of archwing 2.0 will come out in a few months. So when do we get new REAL content?

That the Lich system was more popular is because it was core gameplay. This stuff here is another minigame... and it is not huge spaciship battles like I thoght. Its simply archwing 1.0 with micromanagemnt and a little bigger enemies...

Edited December 14, 2019 by DerGreif2

[XzWasPzX]

I like it if its gonna be "bigger", with more features and stuff, i think its a solid game mode to implement interesting quests. It reminds me to this, dont know why...

 

 

[0_The_F00l]

It is... Mediocre at the moment,

Maybe we are just used to being superstrong even solo (I absolutely blame DE for dropping the ball on balancing) 

It is indeed very very different from the core gameplay,

I have played and unlocked till saturn, and I really didn't play it like warframe, I played it like a space combat game. I almost forgot I was playing warframe a few times when I was on a turret. 

I have already written a long and critical feedback in the megathread, mostly highlighting issue with matchmaking and resource management along with all the bugs I encountered. 

But even as a space combat game it's... Poor, i do hope they don't just abandon it like archwing or conclave

I have also kinda lost interest in playing the main game at the same time, guess this is as far as I could hang on as an active player. Gonna be joining others in the " I will play if I don't have any other games on hand" club till future updates. 

 

[Daziri]

2 hours ago, SordidDreams said:

No one is forcing you to listen to the complaints. Absolutely no one.
  

You must think yourself funny.

That's the end of discussion.

[LazyKnight]

30 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

I don't know about throwing out, but it does need some serious tweaking of existing systems. Things that should be outright deleted are stuff like damage mods, rivens, etc...

Warframe has reached a point where I do not believe any of DE's staff remembers all the systems added to the game. Tweaking system to get the result they want might not be faster than just striping assets they know work and making a new game. 

15 minutes ago, DerGreif2 said:

Warframe is a loot Shooter. WTF has Railjack to do with it?

That's the thoughts I had with Archwing 1.0 and with what i have seen of Railjack( i built one never bothered using it.) I enjoy action games but I zero interest in flight simulators. DE could make the best space sim ever and I wouldn't care.

Edited December 14, 2019 by LazyKnight

[HomicidalGrouse]

54 minutes ago, ValinorAtani said:

Right now I’m not sure if your willing to understand what I wrote above.

I wrote what my first impression was. The first (my personal and only my personal) impression was that DE still has technical issues with their game. Plain Simple. First Missions doesn’t even work (cause technical reasons). So I won’t care about this mode.

If you want to projecting anything else into this. Do it. I won’t care.

The question now is why do you want me to return to the game and force me to play a mode that i wont care about? Why should I play the Quality Department of DE because they got so greedy with an Games Award Announcement instead of delay it till it works more or less for the players? My first impression of the gamemode is now gone to the wind because of this. That was my feedback to them. They had one chance. Didn’t work (again caused by their technical reasons) I won’t return and spending more money right now. Plain simple. If I’m just a statistical number within their feedback doesn’t matter.

Anyway they don’t even care about feedback anymore (even if it’s constructive and well reasonable). That’s just my external view from seeing the last dev stream and reading the lich, arbitration, Fortuna, melee etc etc suggestions and feedback on reddit and the forum. If you want me to blaim for that. Go ahead.

Just note that this situation of the game isn’t yours or mines. It’s DEs problem afterall. And if people will complain about the vision, future or whatever you just have to accept this even if you don’t agree about their opinions. That’s the definition of an discussion.

You're the one whining about the game changing, dude. Not me. If you don't like it, don't play it. If you have something constructive to say, then say it.

You're in a thread defending this notion that nobody wanted the game to change, nobody wanted this content, and DE shouldn't have wasted time making it. That's nothing but entitled whining, and it's not going to result in any kind of change at all.

Put up or shut up, dude. It's as simple as that. That's the whole point.

[Tellakey]

8 minutes ago, 0_The_F00l said:

Maybe we are just used to being superstrong even solo (I absolutely blame DE for dropping the ball on balancing) 

Mind you, I'll reply as someone who only played like 2 Railjack matches and haven't encountered the aforementioned difficulty issue.

As far as this quoted line of yours, I'd argue that it's good we're not superstrong. When I think back on my best time in Warframe, it's definitely the beginning, when I wasn't yet so OP as to make every game a cheese-fest. There is value in being the underdog and making smart combat decisions stemming from this quality. I think Warframe should adopt that direction over the power-fantasy one. I mean look at the Soulsborne genre. People really enjoy playing as the underdog, and for a good reason. It's more stimulating.

So yea, I'd argue that, as you said, Railjack's difficulty doesn't so much mirror early gameplay as it does employ poor design. Just my two cents.

Edited December 14, 2019 by Tellakey

[Tellakey]

4 minutes ago, LazyKnight said:

Warframe has reached a point where I do not believe any of DE's staff remembers all the systems added to the game. Tweaking system to get the result they want might not be faster than just striping assets they know work and making a new game. 

I'm sadly inclined to agree. To be frank, if I knew for sure that Warframe will never get better, I'll take a new game over what we have right now. It's just that pathetic sliver of hope I hold onto that someday DE will decide that enough is enough. Long shot.

[0_The_F00l]

5 minutes ago, Tellakey said:

Mind you, I'll reply as someone who only played like 2 Railjack matches and haven't encountered the aforementioned difficulty issue.

As far as this quoted line of yours, I'd argue that it's good we're not superstrong. When I think back on my best time in Warframe, it's definitely the beginning, when I wasn't yet so OP as to make every game a cheese-fest. There is value in being the underdog and making smart combat decisions stemming from this quality. I think Warframe should adopt that direction over the power-fantasy one. I mean look at the Soulsborne genre. People really enjoy playing as the underdog, and for a good reason. It's more stimulating.

So yea, I'd argue that, as you said, Railjack's difficulty doesn't so much mirror early gameplay as it does employ poor design. Just my two cents.

The difficulty is manageable on earth with at least one other person that knows what they are doing, 

Just one intrinsic in all fields is good enough. Haven't repaired any mk 1 parts yet. 

But I honestly did not play this game to be the underdog, I played the game to be the big bad wolf. 

The current game mode makes me feel like a kitten thrown in a shallow river with hungry dogs around. I won't drown if I keep my head above water, but doing so is likely to get my head bitten off. 

People like different things, I don't need to feel superstrong per se to enjoy the game, but drowning kitten is something I will defintely avoid. 

[-Temp0-]

Цитата

The real question you should be asking is why do you think the game should never change?

This ***** game changes every other month since the launch of the second dream. What the heck are you on about?

But saying so, 'space opera' is the absolute trash course of action one can take. All the micro-management and space battles are infinitely boring. In all other games that had such things be it mass effect or something like dead space, you always wished it would just end already so you can start playing da game again.

Ive yet to see a single person not lying through his teeth that he "liked archwing very much" or saying I like it buuut and archwing was never a core gameplay element, Ive yet to see a single person that signed up for a shooter and got space battles being happy as a result.

And dont even make me start on the "but wait theres more - its a coop!" thing. Absolute dumpster fire.

Цитата

DE isn't just going to remove Railjack because you don't like it.

And thast why this game is on a steady decline.

Developers are chasing their delusions and dreams instead of listening to players. Well its not something uncommon these days, lots of media prefer to push their own agendas and lose money rather than giving consumers what they want and gain money.

Edited December 14, 2019 by -Temp0-

[Tellakey]

1 minute ago, 0_The_F00l said:

The difficulty is manageable on earth with at least one other person that knows what they are doing, 

Just one intrinsic in all fields is good enough. Haven't repaired any mk 1 parts yet. 

But I honestly did not play this game to be the underdog, I played the game to be the big bad wolf. 

The current game mode makes me feel like a kitten thrown in a shallow river with hungry dogs around. I won't drown if I keep my head above water, but doing so is likely to get my head bitten off. 

People like different things, I don't need to feel superstrong per se to enjoy the game, but drowning kitten is something I will defintely avoid. 

Fair enough. You want a fighting chance and the game treats you like a total noob. It would also make ludo-narrative sense for Tenno to not be underdogs but rather competent soldiers. I'll take it. I'll take competent over a god, and you'll take super-competent over a drowning kitty. Works for me.

[nslay]

DE managed to tie Open World and Archwing together to make Railjack... but it's missing the normal mission play. Your Warframe powers don't seem very used in Railjack aside of destroying a crewship or boarding party.

How will DE tie normal mission play into Railjack? It seems they are trying to combine all the concepts and this is what's missing.

[Prexades]

The bugs and some gameplay mechanics are annoying. I think that will eventually even out and the Railjacks could be made a little less fragile, especially against enemies early on. but it is a fun game mode

 

Edited December 14, 2019 by Prexades

[(PSN)CrazyBeaTzu]

2 hours ago, ValinorAtani said:

Who said that i‘m playing it right now? I only tried the first RJ mission. You know what happened? Indefinitely loading screen after the mission ended without any ressources we gained through the mission. That as a first impression of the new hot S#&$? Come on.

I just try to emphatize you for other opionions which you should noticed already because I wasnt speaking from my perspective in my last 2 replies.

That's logically the only thing people should be complaining about, and rightfully so. But I dont care if someone doesn't like the update because they hate archwing, it's not a real reason it's just finding something to not like and thinking the game caters to what you want. Not you personally, just random people.

I personally have been around the block too much: on most games new updates have bugs, they're reported and fixed anywhere from 2 days to a month. People just have to accept that and not try to throw all your eggs in one basket on the 1st day of a content drop. You're setting yourself up for failure just like people who magically forget that rivens are adjusted every few months.

It's a sad part of the gaming world but we're just newly reformed cave men manipulating code. There's gonna be issues and setbacks just like with anything humans do.