So, they're gonna make impact procs open enemies up to parazon finishers.

[Senguash]

From the sound of it, it's somehow even worse than the current proc, which is kind of amazing in itself. 

The problem with the current impact proc is that it displaces the enemy, and that does more harm than the cc is worth in a lot of peoples eyes.

So how about we give it a stun instead?

make the stun scale the amount of hp removed by the hit that applies the proc.

Lets say you can stun each enemy for a maximum of 6 seconds, so the formula for the stun duration is
damage taken / max hp x 6
If you remove 50% of the enemies hp with a cernos shot and land the proc, it gets stunned for 3 seconds.
If you remove 3% of it's hp with a gorgon round and proc it gets stunned for 0.18 seconds.

[Voltage]

That sounds much better than what we have now and what was proposed. I would take anything over the proposition of stuffing Parazon finishers in though. I don't enjoy the Parazon gimmick outside of Liches to be honest, and making it a feature of Impact damage does not make Impact more interesting to me. I could see a stun being pretty decent and not a hindrance to the gameplay experience.

Edited March 13, 2020 by Voltage

[(PSN)sister-hawk]

In what way is it worse? I was not entirely clear on how the changes will work. Seems like impact procs will simply make the Parazon finisher more likely to come up.

[VisionAndVoice]

There is just no pleasing some people.

[Senguash]

9 minutes ago, (PS4)sister-hawk said:

In what way is it worse? I was not entirely clear on how the changes will work. Seems like impact procs will simply make the Parazon finisher more likely to come up.

Doing a parazon finisher is worse than just continuing to shoot the enemy. You briefly cc yourself and your dps output is almost always lower, so why would you?
That means the change is effectively just removing the cc potential of impact procs.

If the change makes it so you can open an enemy up to mercy kill from any hp value with enough procs, then yeah that's useful, but that's not at all what it sounded like.

Edited March 13, 2020 by Senguash

[taiiat]

can we just remove pocket dagger from the game
i actively try to incur Bugs that let me skip the Animation when i'm forced to use it, because it breaks the flow of the entire game, it's frustrating to do even once.

 

anyways Impact is better off just sticking as a sort of Stun, and scaling it, yeah. so a 'higher tier' Impact Status would have a longer Stun than otherwise, Et Cetera.

[(PSN)Quantaminum]

I'm all in for the Parazon finisher.

Unlike melee finisher, that will actually kill tanky enemies, plus Parazon Finisher Mods will be useful outside of Lich missions.

[(PSN)jaggerwanderer]

The parazon has a wire to it, if we can do parazon finisher from a distance, yeah sure it's nice. But if my rubico prime somehow proc that parazon finisher while I'm in skywing at about 100m away... it's not helpful at all.

[OvisCaedo]

It sounds like another really useless change, but at least not one as actively detrimental as the current effect, so it's a step up I guess.

[BornWithTeeth]

If nothing else, it'll make Parazon mods relevant.

[George_PPS]

I hope this wont be another gimmick that slows down gameplay and reduce fluidity. 

[DrivaMain]

That could Make Parazon very meta because the mercy kills is an instant kill regardless of health. Basically they are trying to resurrect Old Covert Lethality.

 

[(NSW)Sniperfox47]

37 minutes ago, Senguash said:

From the sound of it, it's somehow even worse than the current proc, which is kind of amazing in itself. 

The problem with the current impact proc is that it displaces the enemy, and that does more harm than the cc is worth in a lot of peoples eyes.

Yeah...And this still staggers but doesn't displace them... It's a revert to the old system... How is the old system worse than what's been added, when the added stuff literally breaks a bunch of abilities and weapons?

Even if you don't use the newly added parazon stuff (which *is* useful on melee weapons), even then it's just gone back to the old Impact which staggers but doesn't knockdown or ragdoll. This is a massive improvement.

24 minutes ago, Senguash said:

Doing a parazon finisher is worse than just continuing to shoot the enemy. You briefly cc yourself and your dps output is almost always lower, so why would you?
That means the change is effectively just removing the cc potential of impact procs.

If the change makes it so you can open an enemy up to mercy kill from any hp value with enough procs, then yeah that's useful, but that's not at all what it sounded like.

So then just... don't do a Parazon finisher? Just continue to enjoy the stagger while no longer knocking enemies down? And let Impact on your Melee to open up energy, health, or ammo when they need it via the Parazon mods?

 

2 minutes ago, George_PPS said:

I hope this wont be another gimmick that slows down gameplay and reduce fluidity. 

God I really wish they'd:

1) Let us use the 3 Requiem slots for normal Parazon Mods when not in lich missions.

2) Add "utility" Parazon mods like the Glory Kill Runes in DOOM 2016. Things like Parazon Finisher Range (Activate from further away and "blink" to the foe), Parazon Finisher Speed (animation speed multiplier), and Parazon Finisher HP range (open up finishers earlier) would be great mods that would augment the current options.

[Marvelous_A]

And they need to remove the knockdown effect first.

[(PSN)sister-hawk]

30 minutes ago, Senguash said:

Doing a parazon finisher is worse than just continuing to shoot the enemy. You briefly cc yourself and your dps output is almost always lower, so why would you?
That means the change is effectively just removing the cc potential of impact procs.

Tbh I don’t even like normal impact procs. On an enemy that actually takes a few seconds to kill, having them flail around when you are trying to go for headshots is really damn annoying. The benefit of staggering one enemy when you are being shot by 20 is almost non existent.

But either way I don’t believe they are actually removing the stagger effect for a normal proc, unless I misunderstood.

[(NSW)Sniperfox47]

1 minute ago, Marvelous_A said:

And they need to remove the knockdown effect first.

They did. They said so in the Devstream. No knockdown, no ragdoll. Just stagger like it used to. And then a larger stagger after 5 procs.

[Redfeather75]

It will never be used.

Because you have to mod for impact and you have to lower their health to 5% then get into melee range without the enemy dying. Paragon mercy mods are not worth that.

Can you imagine a prime time stream where Rebecca and Megan mod for impact and slowly and carefully try to get enemies down to 5% and yell don't kill him! Because they are trying to get a parazon mod to proc?

I have not tested it out, but for the sake of skill shots and fun, I'd drop the 5% health requirement and turn it to each impact stack gives X% to trigger a parazon mercy prompt if you hit the enemies weak spot during an impact stagger.

Edited March 13, 2020 by Redfeather75

[Loza03]

How is it worse? I mean, it's not really going to do all that much for the parazon but useless but harmless > actively hinders your gameplay.

[Marvelous_A]

10 minutes ago, Redfeather75 said:

It will never be used.

Because you have to mod for impact and you have to lower their health to 5% then get into melee range without the enemy dying. Paragon mercy mods are not worth that.

Can you imagine a prime time stream where Rebecca and Megan mod for impact and slowly and carefully try to get enemies down to 5% and yell don't kill him! Because they are trying to get a paragon mod to proc?

Well I imagine it could be useful versus Nox or maybe Bursa? Not sure if Parazon works on Bursas though.

[(NSW)Greybones]

I like the idea of the enemy being opened to Parazon finishers. It sounds like it’ll add a nice flavour to my gameplay, which I much prefer than chasing “Always gotta kill more effectively”. I already go for the fancy kill if I see one pop up nearby, cause they’re nice to watch (glad that they made it work on more than just Thralls)

There’s mods that make Mercy kills do things like have a chance to drop an energy orb. It’s like a lesser Glory Kill from Doom, which is fun, though in Doom’s case survivability in that game was built around the glory kills, and Mercy Kills seem more of a “If you wanna do it, here you go!”

Edited March 13, 2020 by (NSW)Greybones

[--END--Rikutatis]

A parazon finisher would have been good pre-mainline update, since enemies used to be more tanky and ehp scaled exponentially. So in an endless, using impact to parazon finish high level enemies would have been a viable and interesting option. But right now enemies are like paper thin and super squishy, even level cap enemies die to any unbuffed weapon. So this is kind of useless. But hey, at least it's better than what we had before in that awful knockdown. It's useless but at least it's not a hindrance lol. 

[Kaotyke]

No.

More oportunities for me to use the Blood For Energy and Out of Sight.

[(PSN)robotwars7]

remember, using the Parazon to follow up an impact proc isn't mandatory, it'll jut be an option if you get the chance to close in on the enemy. you can still follow up with another shot from your weapon, or pull out your regular melee... this is just something that might help in a pinch. 

also remember, you get I-frames doing the animation, so it's not like Impact weapons will get you killed.

[OrSpeeder]

This sounds like a TERRIBLE idea until you can get rid of accidental liches.

 

Imagine the amount of newbies that will spam parazon finishers while using high-impact weapons, and suddenly have a lich while they didn't even knew what a lich was.

[DreadWarlock]

3 hours ago, Senguash said:

From the sound of it, it's somehow even worse than the current proc, which is kind of amazing in itself. 

The problem with the current impact proc is that it displaces the enemy, and that does more harm than the cc is worth in a lot of peoples eyes.

So how about we give it a stun instead?

make the stun scale the amount of hp removed by the hit that applies the proc.

Lets say you can stun each enemy for a maximum of 6 seconds, so the formula for the stun duration is
damage taken / max hp x 6
If you remove 50% of the enemies hp with a cernos shot and land the proc, it gets stunned for 3 seconds.
If you remove 3% of it's hp with a gorgon round and proc it gets stunned for 0.18 seconds.

You forgot the whole heavy stagger part of the reworked impact proc, which will pretty much do this: "So how about we give it a stun instead"

The are already making it into a stun, the whole Parazon thing is a secondary effect it won't be the main proc.