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How should Nyx be fixed..?


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3 hours ago, DrivaMain said:

Psychic Bolts :

 

  1. If an enemy affected by a bolt is killed. The bolt will jump into the nearest enemy with 100% of the remaining duration.

I like this one! My ideal changes would look a bit like:

  • Mind control has infinite duration. The initial phase where you boost damage will instead boost health similar to iron skin. Enemies will shoot at target and help with boosts during this phase.
  • Press X to give mind control target your gun, just like with sortie defense/rescue targets. Damage scaling now solved with your gun.
    • Mind control's augment suddenly good now.
  • Always fire 6 psyhic bolts even if there are fewer targets. Redundant bolts converge on the fewer targets, stacking effect if strip is below 100%.
  • When killed, bolts spread to other targets like in suggestion above.
  • Chaos is changed a bit. Affected enemies get a new set of priorities:
    • Priority 1: Get within 20-30m and line of sight from Nyx. (Does not scale with mods)
    • Priority 2: Fight other enemies to earn Nyx' approval.
    • Chaos targets will not target Tenno-side units apart from other Chaos-affected units.
    • Chaos no longer hinders progress by having enemies running around out of sight, is instead helpful and speeds progress up.
  • Don't really care about Absorb. Leave as is for endurance runners.
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Well, Absorb got a big issue, it want to dmg and defense at the same time want to not too OP. It affected by range, effiency, duration and strength. You CAN'T DO THAT. Either it need a dmg buff or an energy cost reduction. 
Well Chaos is good but useless. Her basic kit is all over the place.
Psychic Bolts are absolute trash. Replace it with telekinesys. She can create a bubble thats stops bullets, so why not. The gimmick is already in the game (Grendel, Necramechs) but buff it. It could use the Saints Row style (Elemental damages, heal, use empowered damage against other npc while you throw them.) Mind control should be forgotten because the enemy scaling. Probably more minions will help it and with augment became the base.

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43 minutes ago, Dreadlox said:

Well, Absorb got a big issue, it want to dmg and defense at the same time want to not too OP. It affected by range, effiency, duration and strength. You CAN'T DO THAT. Either it need a dmg buff or an energy cost reduction. 
Well Chaos is good but useless. Her basic kit is all over the place.
Psychic Bolts are absolute trash. Replace it with telekinesys. She can create a bubble thats stops bullets, so why not. The gimmick is already in the game (Grendel, Necramechs) but buff it. It could use the Saints Row style (Elemental damages, heal, use empowered damage against other npc while you throw them.) Mind control should be forgotten because the enemy scaling. Probably more minions will help it and with augment became the base.

Bored Bugs Bunny GIF by MOODMAN

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NYX doesn't really need changes ,

What she needs is a game mode to be relevant in,

She is not a DPS or support frame , she is a  CC frame with minor self boost capability.

There is very little use for auch a frame in the current game.

We need modes where killing could actually be a detriment for her to be relevant.

 

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5 hours ago, BRZZAFK said:

Yeah how creative you people are. De should just forget about the reworking. It's not worth it. 

Reworking can be a great thing, Riot have reworked most of the old, outdated champions in league of legends and it revived many of them.

The problem is when you have design space that is wasted. Mind control is an incredibly interesting and cool thematic, and I don’t feel like Nyx is making use of the design space she occupies.

So, in your eyes, would it be better to make another frame that actually takes advantage of that thematic, rework Nyx to fulfil the fantasy of her design, or leave her as a barely used frame?

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8 hours ago, RazerXPrime said:

Chaos is one of the best and more reliable CC abilities since it gives enemies high aggro. You do not get hit by enemies affected by Chaos unless you're the most unlucky person on the planet. It also stuns enemies for 2 seconds when activated. It's great for defense or rescue missions. It's great for defending your Railjack when boarded. The area is huge and it goes through walls.

The only thing I do not like about Nyx is her 4th ability. It has no synergy with her kit. The mind control is ok, but it could use something like DR for you and transfer damage to the mind controller enemy. I rather have that and then get a new 4th ability that is actually useful and synergizes with her kit. Perhaps something that can interact with her other abilities.

Nyx is great for solo play because you play the game on your terms at all times, not much use when playing with more than 2 people because the more people in the game the faster you kill your enemies, but this kinda is the same for every frame that cannot nuke a room in a second. People measure a frame based on a two things: dps and survivability. Nyx doesn't really fit in those categories so people rate her as trash. But those people are also stupid.

Nyx is already viable.

Then whats her point in the game? Her kit is not fun, not useful for the actual content, the chaos is a mediocre CC at best. I think she is not viable, i want her to be good, but miss all the great opportunity to be great. But hey, Zephyr was in the same position.

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2 minutes ago, Dreadlox said:

Then whats her point in the game? Her kit is not fun, not useful for the actual content, the chaos is a mediocre CC at best. I think she is not viable, i want her to be good, but miss all the great opportunity to be great. But hey, Zephyr was in the same position.

Lol. What do you want me to say to this nonsense? All your comments here are full of nonsense. Sure, you don't like her, don't play her. If you have ideas on how she could be better, that's welcome. But coming in saying she's not viable or that her abilities are useless just shows how little you understand the frame and the game. 

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42 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

Lol. What do you want me to say to this nonsense? All your comments here are full of nonsense. Sure, you don't like her, don't play her. If you have ideas on how she could be better, that's welcome. But coming in saying she's not viable or that her abilities are useless just shows how little you understand the frame and the game. 

Oh i tried so many variables, so many build, so many "this OP Nyx build" that recommended for me, but most of it just cheezing out the small gates what the game offers, not real good builds, like using dodge roll and shield game. I understand her role in this game, but like Hydroid, she is out of date in gameplay. I don't want her to be OP as hell, just to be fun. and the abilities are not fun. 

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42 minutes ago, Dreadlox said:

 I understand her role in this game

I think this is where your issue is. If you limit your view to a role of a frame then yea you're bound to be disappointed by a great many things. Frames don't have roles.

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27 minutes ago, RazerXPrime said:

I think this is where your issue is. If you limit your view to a role of a frame then yea you're bound to be disappointed by a great many things. Frames don't have roles.

Say that to a Trinity main :D 

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9 hours ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

You sure you know how to use it? Level 3500 enemies in this vid.

 

So your argument for her 4 not being buffed is because you can take her into a stationary mission and get fed damage from 3 friends while standing on a pole??  That sounds awesome.   I will try that in my next random squad on a random mission!!  Not.

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10 minutes ago, (PSN)AbBaNdOn_ said:

So your argument for her 4 not being buffed is because you can take her into a stationary mission and get fed damage from 3 friends while standing on a pole??  That sounds awesome.   I will try that in my next random squad on a random mission!!  Not.

No you can do it by yourself man, look again. It's an Octavia spectre for the invis and you position it to fire through your absorb bubble at the enemy, which in turn generates massive AoE damage. It'll cost you some energy, that's about it.

Edited by -CdG-Zilchy
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The problem with Nyx is that she's a relic of the past. A time long gone by.

 

She's focused on CC - which, years ago, was decent enough, but nowadays is outclassed by literally everything because DPS is the new CC. Don't need to control anything when everything's dead.

So I'd say she needs to be more focused on damage rather than outdated CC abilities to make her viable again.

 

- Mind control

Useless. NPC vs NPC damage is like throwing snowballs at the sun. It just doesn't work.

- Psychic Bolts

Too random and weak. It tends to seek out harmless targets and ignoring the "dangerous" ones right in front of you, and then it deals next to no damage. The chance to proc rad doesn't really help either because a unmodded Lato is more effective than that.

- Chaos

Outdated. Even with all the range mods, it just doesn't hold a candle to all the DPS out there. And besides, it doesn't even prevent enemies from attacking you, it just allows them to attack other NPCs as well.

- Absorb

Witht he augment that allows you to walk, it's a semi-decent god mode ability, but other than that, it's worthless.

 

 

What we need is to completely change her theme from CC to DPS.

 

- Mind Control -> Neural Overload (Hold ability)

Fries the brains of nearby targets, dealing damage that increases the longer the button is held.

- Psychic Bolts -> Psychic Barrage (toggle)

Summons several "portals" (or whatever you want to call them. Magic Circles?) in the sky that rains enegy bolts onto enemies in a large area below, dealing AoE damage.

- Chaos -> Status Switch

Removes all negative status effects from the player and squad members and applies them to nearby enemies instead.

- Absord -> Death Sentence

Casts a energy field around Nyx that catches enemy projectiles and throws them back at enemies for double damage.

 

That's the best I can come up with right now.

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15 minutes ago, o0Despair0o said:

- Psychic Bolts

Too random and weak. It tends to seek out harmless targets and ignoring the "dangerous" ones right in front of you, and then it deals next to no damage. The chance to proc rad doesn't really help either because a unmodded Lato is more effective than that.

Psychic bolts is all about stripping defenses(which it does really well) not doing damage.

Edited by -CdG-Zilchy
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15 hours ago, (XBOX)Apoll0 666 said:

I have avoided her, for like the longest time, still haven't used her so it's not my place to speak of her and her problems tbh. But her concept alone looks... looks like they took a concept and had no idea what to do with it. Psychic Bolts..? What, I mean I guess.. 

Anyways, what are her main issues?

What causes the issues?

Does Nyx need ability reworks or stat reworks?(I think psychic bolts need to be swapped with something, like a telekinesis character uses bolts as on of their main gimmicks : //)

Lemme hear it, and what are her current "gameplay band aids" ? Because I've avoided her but want her so bad plus her deluxe skins are probs some of the best, I just dont want to be disappointed so I'm saving her for when I need the MR.

Yeah the surveys went up your head. Very nice of you doing them tho, I appreciated. 

How can you said she has problems if you don't play her ?Psychic bolts strips 100% armor and disables infested auras without interruption and effort. 

Nyx it's fine, it can't be fixed becouse it's not broken. 

She has CC, damage, buffs and debuff abilities, also the best fashion indeed. 

 

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16 hours ago, (XBOX)Apoll0 666 said:

I have avoided her, for like the longest time, still haven't used her so it's not my place to speak of her and her problems tbh.

Aaaand I stopped reading there.

Don't ask for fixes/changes to a warframe you don't even play, thank you very much.

Signed,

A Nyx main

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Remove that from her 4:
 

Quote

An additional 8 energy is drained for every 1000 damage that's absorbed. Absorb will end if Nyx runs out of energy, or if deactivated by pressing the ability key again (default 4 ).


Make her 1 be a real cc(enemies start shooting only at the controlled dude and nothing else in a large range).

That will be good enough for me.

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11 hours ago, (XBOX)GearsMatrix301 said:

Being able to go hours and hours on end in a survival does not translate to being effective at all the other content in the game.

Revenants also a big offender of this. People praise his one shot gimmick like it’s some be all end all move, but in reality it’s more effective to just shoot the enemies. The fact that Rev mains complain that team mates kill their thralls before they can be Reaved is proof of this.

Nyx is the same way. Just because you can technically abuse the mechanics of her abilities to last forever in a survival. That doesn’t mean those abilities have any practical use outside of that one niche.

Super long endurance runs are impractical anyway. Why go for a 10 hour survival run when you can do five 2 hour survivals? It’s the same exact rewards at significantly less risk.

Actually Nyx's 4 is better for defense, not survival. I can use Nyx in all the game's content successfully, she's a beast in Steel Path. I suggest you go and actually use the frame before making assumptions. And there's no need to drag your long standing anti-revenant agenda in here either.

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Step 1:

Acknowledge there are Warframes people don't like.

Step 2:

Said people just play Warframes they like.

She just needs adjustments to fit how Warframes are designed now, not an actual rework like people suggest; which often amounts turning her into another dps Warframe. Don't like cc/utility? Don't use them then. Removing armor alone is already extremely strong of a dps increase against specific enemies. The fact it also removes shields and other interactions it has is also good; as other armor removals generally only remove armor on top of needing insane strength investment for 100%.

6 hours ago, _R_o_g_u_e_ said:

Reworking can be a great thing, Riot have reworked most of the old, outdated champions in league of legends and it revived many of them.

Except, it hasn't. The only reworks that increased popularity only occurred due to their kits being insanely broken by design. Without this being the case, all it does is upset the people that liked them as they were. Karma for example, one of the earlier reworks, upset a lot of the people that originally played her. She is rarely played other than when she's meta. Her kit is also stuck in the phase of either being too good, or worthless, as her role shifted into a burst mage with utility, or a shield bot.

Then you have cases of a cc tank, like Sejuani, being reworked into a tank with barely any cc by comparison and focused heavily on dealing burst damage. She isn't any more popular than she was pre-rework either. She's almost the least played jungler, and is the least picked for top lane.

There's also the fact reworks in the game aren't even always about "reviving" them, but because their kits are impossible to balance. Which often times, the rework doesn't even solve that issue... Ryze got reworked, then changed again, and still needs a rework again. Poppy got a rework because her original form was pretty much insanely overpowered and Riot even said if she ever got picked in pro play frequently before her rework, she was going to be nerfed right into the ground.

Reworks based on pick/usage rates are absurd anyways. When you have tens to eventually 100+ options, naturally some options are going to have low pick/usage rates due to there being too many options. There's also the issue of overlapping kits. Warframe already has multiple instances of Warframes doing more or less the same exact thing, and the one that does that same thing better is going to be used more often.

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17 hours ago, Teridax68 said:

 

  •  

"She only really does one thing, which is turn enemies against one another.

Many frames whose main contribution isn't even crowd control have better crowd control than she does, e.g. Nidus.

Her only other strength (survivability) is either incredibly unreliable (i.e. her passive) or requires her to essentially cripple herself (i.e. her 4, with or without its augment) while draining massive amounts of Energy, all to achieve what other frames can do without much trouble.

Her kit in general is clunky, gimmicky, limited, and full of redundancy, and anyone playing her can feel her age despite her rework."

Highly inaccurate:

She doesn't do "one thing". That means you personally are using her for one thing. Nyx, like basically all frames, can be used for multiple playstyles, similar to wukong being made specifically for spy versus an arbitration, khora for defense or just whipping etc.

Many frames use mods for survival and/or Vazarin for example. Any frame can use Adaptation, arcane grace/guardian, quick thinking etc. 

She is far from clunky as well: she can cast some abilities while parkouring making them seamless. It depends on if the player behind Nyx actually knows what they're doing. 

 

"Turning enemies against one another is generally not great, because enemy AI is terrible and enemy damage scales terribly against enemy EHP. Chaos, despite being Nyx's main attraction, is unreliable because affected enemies can still attack Nyx and her allies.

Mind Control and Chaos are two abilities that essentially do the same thing, i.e. turn enemies to Nyx's side.

Psychic Bolts has no reason to have a target limit while plenty of other frames can casually strip masses of enemies of armor and shields, particularly when that's generally the only thing the ability does.

Absorb forces Nyx to stand still and has this really antiquated bonus Energy drain that also, for whichever reason, also happens with ally damage, allowing teammates to troll her (usually accidentally) by dropping her to 0 Energy in a flash. Assimilate is an essential augment, yet still makes her painfully slow."

 

Inaccurate again, it is great and is incredibly useful. An actual experienced player can survive an occasional stray bullet. Whether enemies attack you is also based on proximity.

Mind control is 1 single target...and chaos is a wide aoe if the player chooses. So no...they don't "essentially do the same thing".

  • Passive: Nyx stuns enemies while they remain near her aiming reticle.
  • 1 - Mind Control: Nyx reduces her maximum health and shields to turn an enemy to her side. The enemy gains perfect accuracy, forgoes defensive tactics, and deals bonus damage scaling with enemy level and Power Strength. Mind Controlled enemies prioritize targets stunned by Nyx's passive. The ability costs no Energy, and holding it releases mind controlled enemies from Nyx's grasp, restoring her reduced health and shields.
    • Augment - Mind Meld: When Nyx takes fatal damage, her weakest Mind Controlled minion dies instead, making her invulnerable for a short duration.
  • 2 - Telekinesis: Nyx pulls the target enemy and holds them in front of her, draining Energy continuously while they are held. While held, the enemy is stunned and intercepts incoming attacks, taunting enemies in view to attack it. Casting the ability again throws the enemy towards the target point, causing them to damage themselves and nearby enemies for a portion of its maximum health and shields, plus the damage they absorbed, the latter of which scales with enemy level and Power Strength.
    • Augment - Telekinetic Pacification: Enemies in the impact zone are confused for a duration.
  • 3 - Chaos: Nyx marks the target enemy for a duration, causing it to emit an aura that reduces its maximum armor and shields as well as that of other nearby enemies, while causing affected enemies to attack the target. The armor and shield reduction aura persists even after the target dies.
    • Augment - Spreading Chaos: If the original target dies, all affected enemies become targets of Chaos for its remaining duration, spreading to further enemies until the ability ends.
  • 4 - Absorb: Nyx activates a telekinetic field around herself that absorbs all nearby enemy attacks for a short duration, releasing the absorbed damage in a radial explosion whose damage scales with affected enemies' level, as well as Power Strength. For a short duration afterwards, the ability's Energy cost is doubled, stacking infinitely.
    • Augment - Assimilate: Chaos no longer inflicts an explosion, but instead generates an aura during its post-invulnerability duration that deals a portion of the explosion damage each second.         

 

Nyx isn't Xaku, but nice try, her psychic bolts are fine as they are: a quick and instant result for a single button press. Sure it'd be nice to affect more enemies, but I make it work either way. 

Nyx doesn't need to target anyone for chaos. All we have to do now is a single input and you get instant aoe chaos stun. Nyx is not Xaku.

I also don't need my health and shields lowered, either. 

Let's start with tweaks first....I don't agree with this rework at all.

"If you want to make the most of Nyx in her current state, the main thing you need is her Assimilate augment: this is what single-handedly lets her survive in high-level missions, not just because it lets her move, but also because it prevents allies from draining her Energy if they shoot at her (why this interaction wasn't removed on the base ability is beyond me). Once you have that and some Range+Duration mods, you should be all set."

Wrong again. As I've already said: 

Nyx is more than assimilate, if you can't handle playing her any other way, that's an issue with you as a player and not Nyx specifically.

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19 hours ago, Aldain said:

Nyx's problems are as follows:

1: Mind Control is a meme at best, enemy-on-enemy damage is basically nothing the higher up levels go. It also is likely the number one replaced ability via the Helminth system, not gonna say that for sure, but it just seems like the logical choice.

2: Psychic Bolts are severely overhyped because they are a one-button solution to one of the overarching problem of Warframe's enemy balance as it can delete 100% of an enemy's armor, however at most of the usual levels of the game this level of armor/shield strip is pointless overkill on top of already pointless overkill.

3: Chaos is a glorified Radiation proc and only reduces the odds of getting attacked, while other frames can consistently shut down the A.I. completely instead. Even Oberon's Hallowed Ground can deliver a similar effect AND provide aid for a party, while Chaos just makes already dumb A.I. even dumber.

4: Absorb is basically either a mediocre damage ability or one of the most unga-bunga tier "I'm invincible" abilities in the game, which again only exists to counteract the insane imbalance of how enemy-on-player damage scales.

Basically everything she's good at is either done better by some other frames, or only is applauded because it cuts the knot that is Warframe's imbalance.

Nyx's main use is Interception.  All while interception is probably one of the lamest game types out there. Against corpus you just drop a random specter and have it hold position and they pop nullies 90% of the time. There is no better interception frame, hands down. I dont even have to kill anyone even if they get in range of the capture point. Void dash sends them across the map. No more conflict. Ive been using Nyx for a really long time now. She is literally an S Tier Interception frame.

Nyx was created in 2013(update 6). Her kit was viable then and it still is now, even more with Helminth. The problem with you guys is you want 1 frame to do everything, instead of having a variety of frames. "But Oberon" is really useless unless youre in a group. You have given 0 insight on how to "fix" Nyx but offer what the problems are, while people like myself use Nyx all the time without much to complain about.

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8 hours ago, 0_The_F00l said:

NYX doesn't really need changes ,

What she needs is a game mode to be relevant in,

She is not a DPS or support frame , she is a  CC frame with minor self boost capability.

There is very little use for auch a frame in the current game.

We need modes where killing could actually be a detriment for her to be relevant.

 

I'd like to see a gamemode where people had to be more careful about just randomly spamming kill abilities and aoe weapons; and frames like Nyx made sense. 

Maybe some kind of exterminate style map, except you are hunting specific more powerful troops/commanders and some elite squads as well, etc. and if you kill the wrong enemies you lose points and can even fail the mission if you kill too many normal scrub troops. You gain points and complete objectives by getting the correct enemies killed with as little collateral damage (random scrub enemies that aren't marked for kill) as possible. 

More targeted cc would also be more useful in something like that, for example frames like Vauban would want to use their abilities more cleverly to keep enemies seperated, instead of doing lazy stuff like Vortexing everything with max range, and still being able to do a damage build on top of it for the hell of it if they feel like it because Tesla Bank doesn't take power strength into account. 

I could also see a map like this where maybe you are going to free a colony from the grineer or something, and you have to take out elite troops without accidentally killing too many colonist bystanders or destroying their homes. 

That would be a neat way to make us feel more connected to the consequences of our actions and the universe around us, and more make us feel how Tenno are supposed to be the hero of the common man. 

Something like "Colony Liberation Mission" or something like that idk. 

Edited by Tesseract7777
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2 hours ago, -CdG-Zilchy said:

Actually Nyx's 4 is better for defense, not survival. I can use Nyx in all the game's content successfully, she's a beast in Steel Path. I suggest you go and actually use the frame before making assumptions. And there's no need to drag your long standing anti-revenant agenda in here either.

Even defense missions have better options than Nyx these days.

Theres better frames for Steel Path than Nyx.

I’ll use Nyx when she’s actually made good.

I was showing that there’s multiple examples of frames with niches having those niches massively overvalued when the reality is they are useless everywhere else that matters.

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