Soaktron Skin should be applied to more Primary Weapons

[Corvid]

17 minutes ago, Fl_3 said:

Wait what? Wasn't Reb using the Ignis with this skin during the Dev stream?

Nope, she was using one of the Boltor variants.

[(XBOX)Big Roy 324]

2 hours ago, Corvid said:

Nope, she was using one of the Boltor variants.

Boltor prime

Considering the restrictions it makes sense she chose a weapon like that now. As nothing about the boltor says squirt gun. 

[KVenom]

Basicly, so far it's only applicable to bullet-based primaries, and it's frustrating, cuz they are actually niche weapons, Acceltra, Synapse, Amprex - those are the few examples of Primary Weapons that definetly need that skin to be applied to them.

Some automatic rifles with Alt Fire options should also be considered(Staltha/Argonak)

Please, consider adding those to the list for Soaktron Skin.

Thanks in advance.

[NetworkGuy]

I just brought it and found it does not work on the majority of prime weapons I use (e.g. Ignis, Fulmin, Rubico,  etc.). The only one I found so far is the Soma. 

Very disappointing. 

[Sixes_Wild]

1 hour ago, NetworkGuy said:

I just brought it and found it does not work on the majority of prime weapons I use (e.g. Ignis, Fulmin, Rubico,  etc.). The only one I found so far is the Soma. 

Very disappointing. 

Correct, right now the skin is limited to true 'rifle' type guns, nothing that shoots a stream of energy, grenades or what not.  The hope is that perhaps they would open the skin up to universal use, or maybe even just add the  "launcher" category of weapons, which includes things like ignis, penta, acceltra etc etc.

[Oreades]

OK so saw the new soaktron skin and the first thing that came to mind is that is literally the perfect skin for the Ignis which technically uses rifle ammunition but I don't think it's a "rifle" exactly but I can't recall it's sub category and the game doesn't' seem to say and even the Wiki is hit and miss for what exactly weapons are.  I mean I think it's a "thrower?" but only the Ignis comes up when searching that not the Wraith so, I kinda give up on the "what it is" front. 

That said I was holding out hope that it was compatible with the Ignis because aesthetically it is heccin spot on for the Ignis series and it really seems unfortunate that it doesn't.

[GentlePuppet]

It should be able to be equipped on everything that uses "RIFLE" Mods.
People should be able to choose if they want to have silly combos like a rubico prime water soaker.
Or an Opticor soaker that is shoots highly pressurized water streams.

[Oreades]

1 hour ago, GentlePuppet said:

It should be able to be equipped on everything that uses "RIFLE" Mods.
People should be able to choose if they want to have silly combos like a rubico prime water soaker.
Or an Opticor soaker that is shoots highly pressurized water streams.

I think the problem is that Rifle is such a nebulous and ill defined term in this game that saying something is a Rifle skin doesn't really mean anything. 

So I would be inclined to extend that beyond just Rifle Mods because I'm relatively sure (without checking in game) that the Zarr doesn't use rifle mods but is considered by the game as a Rifle for the sake of "Rifle Only" Sortie missions. inb4 the Zarr does use rifle mods, it's been such a long time since I finished it's build that I can't recall without actually loading up the game. I want to say that when I searched for launchers it didn't come up but I could be mistaken there too. 

If the issue is the firing animations, I'd think some sort of if/else would work
EG If the weapon in question uses projectiles that are compatible with (I assume) the water animation of the skin then use the water animations. 
Else use the weapons default munition animation applied to the coordinates of the end of the skin. 

Probably over simplified but

 

Either Iether way I really feel DE needs to make a push to identify what is what within the game itself. Cause I've played this game for years now and frequently have no clue what exactly things are classified as. 

[Marcooose]

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

The Soaktron skin will remain compatible with most assault rifles. Considering the vast amount the changes would affect internally - we do not have any current plans to overhaul the Soaktron Rifle Skin. 

Thank you for your understanding! 
 

[Leqesai]

25 minutes ago, [DE]Marcus said:

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

The Soaktron skin will remain compatible with most assault rifles. Considering the vast amount the changes would affect internally - we do not have any current plans to overhaul the Soaktron Rifle Skin. 

Thank you for your understanding! 
 

How about alterations to the energy color? The energy color of this skin doesn't match other liquids we currently have available for fashion frame. IE: Liquids from Lavos gear

[(PSN)haphazardlynamed]

33 minutes ago, [DE]Marcus said:

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

The Soaktron skin will remain compatible with most assault rifles. Considering the vast amount the changes would affect internally - we do not have any current plans to overhaul the Soaktron Rifle Skin. 

Thank you for your understanding! 
 

So basically, weapon skins are Tied to base weapon types

the soaktron skin is stuck to bullet weapons, and these type limits prevent it from being also workable on Beams because (internal reasons).

Easy Fix: Create a Separate Skin, tied to the beam base weapon type, which Looks Identical to the soaktron skin.

work around the type limits instead of trying to overhaul them.

 

[Tesseract7777]

1 minute ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

So basically, weapon skins are Tied to base weapon types

the soaktron skin is stuck to bullet weapons, and these type limits prevent it from being also workable on Beams because (internal reasons).

Easy Fix: Create a Separate Skin, tied to the beam base weapon type, which Looks Identical to the soaktron skin.

work around the type limits instead of trying to overhaul them.

 

Hmm... would that be as easy as you make it sound though?

I don't pretend to be an expert on programming, but I know enough to know that it may not be that simple, especially considering all the things going on with their custom game engine that I don't understand, as it is proprietary. 

[Thawfoot]

1 hour ago, [DE]Marcus said:

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

Well thanks for clearing up this mess.. but a little late... after watching DE Megan stream on 6/7/21  @ 55 min mark she says any riffle...far as she knows....Kinda sucks it doesnt fit on most rifles

After purchasing....

Well yet another DE lesson learned...

Take everything DE employees say with a grain of salt

[(NSW)Filgaia]

1 hour ago, [DE]Marcus said:

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

The Soaktron skin will remain compatible with most assault rifles. Considering the vast amount the changes would affect internally - we do not have any current plans to overhaul the Soaktron Rifle Skin. 

Thank you for your understanding! 
 

Well at least semi auto rifles like the Latron and Sybaris can use it, so that makes it a little more like the soaktron

[(NSW)Gamer-Steve]

1 hour ago, [DE]Marcus said:

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

Sorry to interrupt, but are there any other weapon compatibility issues with the other Oscira skins that you know of? I did mention it on the Dog days thread, but I don't currently know why the Oscira Pistol skin wouldn't work on something like the Kuva Nukor, as an example. Unless I'm mistaken, I somewhat recall that the Oscira collection was said to be be universal.

• Quote from [DE]Megan: *Edit: Corrected the Oscira weapon skin names. Originally they were dedicated to the new player starter weapons, but we then changed them to be universal Staff, Pistol, Thrown Blade, Rifle, Bow, and Longsword Skins.

 

Not that I'm complaining of course! I've just been wondering about things like this for quite awhile.

[Zahnny]

1 hour ago, [DE]Marcus said:

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

The Soaktron skin will remain compatible with most assault rifles. Considering the vast amount the changes would affect internally - we do not have any current plans to overhaul the Soaktron Rifle Skin. 

Thank you for your understanding! 
 

Not to be "that guy"
 

But as someone who wants a skin or something for the Miter and I have a vendetta against the Panthera for using the Holy Miter as crafting material, I thought I should let you know both Panthera's which shoot blades can use the Soaktron and Oscira skin.

51 minutes ago, (PSN)haphazardlynamed said:

So basically, weapon skins are Tied to base weapon types

the soaktron skin is stuck to bullet weapons, and these type limits prevent it from being also workable on Beams because (internal reasons).

Easy Fix: Create a Separate Skin, tied to the beam base weapon type, which Looks Identical to the soaktron skin.

work around the type limits instead of trying to overhaul them.

 

This would probably make the most sense, it'd require a unique ID for each primary weapon rifle catagory as you'd make duplicates in the code, but in theory this is probably easier than simply overhauling the entire thing under the hood.

Then simply register it to give players all of them at the same time, while the display makes it seem like it's just the one.

[Paranoicon]

Alright, I've tried condensing my thoughts into something a bit more constructive than "This is S#&$e and I hate it", so:

Quote

This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance.

I'm going to go into my point with the assumption made that this detail up here is not something that is going to be homogenized in much the same way shotguns are. I am not trying to be uncharitable, mind, I'm just making the assumption that it's not a worthwhile change to make because it'd end up breaking more than it would fix.

Now, if that's not happening, then I'd argue clarity is second best. If every "universal" rifle skin is subjected to those back-end limitations, that should be reflected in the information that is presented to the playerbase. It's painfully obvious a lot of people got this skin expecting it to work on "rifles". And I'm putting that on quotes because of how poorly presented the info of what exactly a "rifle" is is in the game. The amount of weapons presented as "rifles" is genuinely astounding. Doubly so when many of those weapons (IE: Ignis, Opticor, Simulor) can not be genuinely described as rifles. That said, there are ways to present this information to the playerbase in ways that are not as broad and, honestly, inaccurate.

Trigger types. As far as I've tested, the Soaktron and Oscira skins DO NOT APPLY to any "rifles" that have an Active, Auto-Burst, Charge, and Held Trigger Types. As well as not applying to weapons that have "hybrid" trygger types. IE: ones that can swap between different trigger types.
Quick note: Apparently, the Miter can equip the Soaktron skin despite having a Hold trigger type.

However, both of those skins apply to MOST "rifles" that have an Auto, Burst and Semi-auto trigger types. Excluding, of course, weapons that have special projectiles like the Acceltra or Basmu, and weapons with alt fire or alt utilities, like the Stahlta, Quellor and Harpak.

My point is for that information that I have presented up there to be available in the game itself. Preferably attached to the appropriate skins, for people to be properly informed of what they are purchasing/farming for before they get it. So they are not disappointed that it doesn't work with the thing they wanted to use it on. This is stuff that should have been communicated beforehand, with the Soaktron and the Oscira rifle skin. And not in the forums, not in twitter, not in the streams. In the game itself. In the direct description of the skins themselves.

Anything else is not acceptable.

EDIT: For the sake of clarity, I'm referring to weaponry, in game, that uses Rifle Ammo. Not stuff that uses Sniper Ammo, or Shotgun Ammo, or any type of ammunition that's not the usual blue.

[NenihS]

I don't normally post on the forums but this one stung.

It has been FOUR YEARS since the Nox was introduced and I have wanted their weapon ever since the moment I saw it. This is well beyond "Ghoul Saw" territory.

I saw that it was a skin and was initially annoyed but hey, it's a usable asset outside of Dog Days (which taunted me for over a year previously)

Seeing as very few primaries except maybe the Torid (can it use the skin?) function similarly to the Stug or Nox's gun in-mission, I spent a couple hours fiddling with making a kitgun- a Sporelacer, to be exact, to emulate the original weapon better. Now, the Sporelacer uses shotgun mods- you can probably see where this is going- and SUBSEQUENTLY CANNOT USE THE SKIN.

The gun's fine and fun, but it looks dumb and the entire intention behind acquiring it was invalidated by whatever weird decision-making process goes into assigning skin types. I can understand that some which have Alt-fires or specific fire modes, reloads, whatever- may not play nice with the skins, sure, but some of them seem way out of place and I feel that Kitguns in particular are WELL overdue for more cosmetic applications after Zaws got fixed up for whatever issues they had with skins previously

It's incredibly irritating on so many levels and I didn't even enter into it with anything resembling expectations. For something designed to be fun it is really, REALLY not.

[(PSN)corpusbonds]

Honestly I really wish I knew this before hand before I bought it. Pretty sure it was mentioned in the Devstream about the ignis and the skin. 
 
 I wouldn’t have purchased the skin if I knew it was only for a very few rifles. 

[TARINunit9]

2 hours ago, Paranoicon said:

Now, if that's not happening, then I'd argue clarity is second best. If every "universal" rifle skin is subjected to those back-end limitations, that should be reflected in the information that is presented to the playerbase. It's painfully obvious a lot of people got this skin expecting it to work on "rifles". And I'm putting that on quotes because of how poorly presented the info of what exactly a "rifle" is is in the game. The amount of weapons presented as "rifles" is genuinely astounding. Doubly so when many of those weapons (IE: Ignis, Opticor, Simulor) can not be genuinely described as rifles. That said, there are ways to present this information to the playerbase in ways that are not as broad and, honestly, inaccurate.

-snip-

My point is for that information that I have presented up there to be available in the game itself. Preferably attached to the appropriate skins, for people to be properly informed of what they are purchasing/farming for before they get it. So they are not disappointed that it doesn't work with the thing they wanted to use it on. This is stuff that should have been communicated beforehand, with the Soaktron and the Oscira rifle skin. And not in the forums, not in twitter, not in the streams. In the game itself. In the direct description of the skins themselves.

Anything else is not acceptable.

I agree with both these points:

There is definitely ambiguity with "rifle" in general. There are at least two, possibly up to five definitions of the word "rifle," and they are not joint sets: there's "blue rifle ammo" which is a very big set, and there's the much more nebulous "whatever can equip the soaktron skin" definition that isn't even consistent (apparently the Miter can be a soaktron).

And DE has a serious problem with info not being in the game. If you want to learn how to play, say, Plague Star, you have to read the patch notes. Outdated patch notes! What other company does this? It's absurd

[-BellaMuerte-]

I just purchased the weapon skin even being aware of the limitations and yet I'm still surprised about them...

[kyori]

6 hours ago, [DE]Marcus said:

the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets

Perhaps to avoid future disappointment from players, why not make it a real gun instead of a skin?

[GentlePuppet]

8 hours ago, [DE]Marcus said:

the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets.

This is Not Entirely True Marcus.

The following bullet shooting rifles can not use the skin. 
   The Rubico
   The Vectis
   The Snipetron

However, some non bullet weapons like the Hema and the Chakkhurr can use the skin.

There appears to be no rhyme or reason for what weapons can and can't use it.

Maybe list what weapons skins can be used on somewhere in the UI when you hover over skins. Maybe in a separate {TAB}page on the weapon. So people are fully aware and can check if they want to buy a skin.

[_R_o_g_u_e_]

12 hours ago, [DE]Marcus said:

We want to clear up any potential confusion for Soaktron Rifle Skin compatibility. It’s true that not all rifles are built the same! Broadly speaking, the Skin is compatible with rifles that simply shoot bullets. This compatibility stems from internal back-end weapon types, weapon animations, and Skin complications with certain alt-fire modes affecting gun performance. 

This means any beam weapon, launcher, bow, shotgun, speargun, armcannon, crossbow or projectile based weapon is not compatible. Additionally, some alt-fire modes on these rifles will also make the skin incompatible with those weapons - similar to the Oscira Assault Rifle skin. 

The Soaktron skin will remain compatible with most assault rifles. Considering the vast amount the changes would affect internally - we do not have any current plans to overhaul the Soaktron Rifle Skin. 

Thank you for your understanding! 
 

What are we supposed to trust? I mean even in this response you’re wrong. There are many rifles that “shoot bullets” the skin doesn’t work on, and rifles that have unique projectiles that it does.

This is really quite disappointing, and doesn’t paint DE in a positive light.

[Dairaion]

tell me im wrong. i was surprised when it didn't work of the ignis, which is literally the same mechanism with a lit flame at the nozzle.