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Apparently DE still can't figure out NW after YEARS in game.


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Nightwave's problem has always been that it just didn't make sense for DE from the word go. having 1-2 story drive 'seasons' a year meant they were effectively committing to 1-2 new quests a year, plus whatever unique goodies were part of it, new enemies, new cinematics... 

It, frankly, didn't make sense when they announced it and still doesn't. If Nightwave had been an endgame thing- the last major system they were ever going to put in- then fine, fair enough. But to have nightwave making the same demands as a new event every four to six months, plus running regular events on top of that and new content drops (However flawed) on top of those? 

It should have always been a fire and forget system like alerts were, requiring no input from DE to run. 

 

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The vibe I get from every single thread that is "complaining" about NW, you feel like entitled spoiled brats who think they are just supposed to have everything hand delivered/spoon fed to you. NW is miles better than alerts, just watching old YT videos of people complaining about alerts, old threads on here buried deep in the forums of alert complaints. DE made something that works on your schedule, not the games'. It's a good thing DE doesn't do like Destiny 2, every "season" you actually have to pay to get access to the real part of the season. Whatever season had the bunkers opening on all the planets, yeah the free part couldn't do anything with those bunkers, only paid players got to access them. No matter what DE does, you entitled crackers will do nothing but complain complain complain.

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i think they won't release the last part till they create a mastery rank 30 test and decide what are they going to do with the MR30

You see founders need 2990 pts to get MR30, and if they release the last act of nightwave that mean we will fight the Glassmaker and we know he will drop a new weapon so founder will get the 3K mastery needed to get MR30

basically we need to wait till they finish the preparations for MR30 for the founders

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37 minutes ago, Yamazuki said:

I don't get why these "seasons" can't just be split into two. Having a year containing only two of these is pretty bad and I don't understand the point in copying what other games do but failing to keep up on the reward aspect. Other games are getting a few rotations out of a year.

NW was also meant to be a more consistent replacement to alerts, but there's nothing consistent about NW either.

DE just doesn't have the manpower to maintain Nightwave. They really need more personnel, so that they can have a dedicated NW team that can produce story and reward content for Nightwave. With DE's current resources, they can't do what Bungie or Infinity Ward do with their battle pass systems.

In the future, it would be good if DE would link together their open world and tileset content through Nightwave, kinda like how Infinity Ward and Bungie do. Using Heart of Deimos as an example, imagine if HoD launched with a Deimos-themed Nightwave season, and if Deimos activities and rewards were directly linked to Nightwave. Instead of separate vendors requiring you to trade standing for rewards, you can complete bounties for each vendor, which reward you with Nightwave XP. Rewards that are previously tied to vendor offerings are now Nightwave rewards. With each vendor offering their own bounties, the activities are now structured to where you can choose which activities you want to do to rank up. You're not forced into doing a particular activity. All related activities reward XP.

For a non-open world example, imagine if Deadlock Protocol released in conjunction with a Nightwave Season. Much like alerts, special Deadlock Protocol missions could reward XP. They wouldn't be any different than how Fissure or Kuva Lich missions work, where they overlap standard missions. These would be themed around Deadlock Protocol, but would involve Warframe's core gameplay. Mission completion would reward XP.

Steel Path could've been done similarly.

Of course, there would still be challenges that would also reward XP.

 

Point to all of this is, DE needs to link their content in a much more structured way, and I think tying in all of their content through Nightwave would be a great way of improving the core gameplay experience as well as regularly having Nightwave content. Only thing would be that it would prioritize core gameplay over farming. I don't see that as a bad thing, however, because 1) you could still have some non-Nightwave content (like new Warframes and weapons) that require farming and 2) now, not all new content would be locked behind ridiculous RNG. You'd still be grinding for items, only through Nightwave and through doing activities that you actually enjoy because you'd have a choice.

Edited by OniDax
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I like Nightwave conceptually. Its a good replacement for alerts. It does not need to be this complex. the story thing doesn't matter too much, but I can't imagine it takes very long to do what they used to, make some dioramas, record some lines. easy. They have some neat cosmetics in the first 30 ranks, give new players a shot at some forma, slots w/e... At the current pace we will be lucky if a new intermission even starts this year. I really hope they end this soon after ep 5 is out.

 

im sick of glass resonance

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1 hour ago, Opetyr said:

Yeah but now we are capped at rank 90 and it is going to be around probably for another 2+ months.  Alerts at least kept happening.  I enjoyed alerts.  This system is even worse than alerts because when you are maxed it is like all alerts are turned off. This was supposed to be better than alerts.  At least with alerts they were always some coming around.  Heck they even had miny mission challenges every mission that were enjoyable which are just the stupid 1k nw standing.

You mean the alerts that most people just ignored most of anyway? Those alerts? 

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They should have kept Alerts around. They were a great source of resources, hot-spots for matchmaking, random goodies with immediate "do this, get reward" style play rather than "do this, and this, and this, and this, and eventually get reward in a few weeks", and all of this randomly, making the game feel more alive and active. (I'd decrease the number of alerts, and increase the length of time they stay active, with important ones staying up at least 24hrs, and the rest between 4 and 8hrs) I've posted my entire Alert rework in previous threads - that's the main thrust of it. Alerts should give standing to the current Nightwave, and be themed around the Nightwave with flavor text for mission descriptions, and in-mission goals that cater to the Nightwave.

Nightwave can be the slow burn, work toward goals on your own time. For this to work, the Cred shop needs to be fixed, not rotating its inventory, and creds need to never expire. There should also always be a way to skip certain acts or swap them out with an act of your choice to avoid instances of people unable to do Profit-Taker or capturing all 3 Eidolons in a night, or helping Clem, when you already did that for the week, etc.

 

 

 

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3 minutes ago, (PS4)PoKerZ2017 said:

I wish they would drop the story and minigames. I don't care about any of it just lemme get my potatoes. 

Ah yes, the potatoes we were lucky to get more than 2 of per month before nightwave? How many did you get this season, do you figure? Definitely time for torches and pitchforks. Sure. Uh huh. Yup. 

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3 hours ago, Opetyr said:

Yeah but now we are capped at rank 90 and it is going to be around probably for another 2+ months.  Alerts at least kept happening.  I enjoyed alerts.  This system is even worse than alerts because when you are maxed it is like all alerts are turned off. This was supposed to be better than alerts.  At least with alerts they were always some coming around.  Heck they even had miny mission challenges every mission that were enjoyable which are just the stupid 1k nw standing.

With the credits you get from nightwave to 90 ranks you will have gotten more stuff there than you would have gotten in the alert system if you played 24-7 for a year .  Also alerts very rarely had special challenges on them and when they did they were typically special alerts created by DE themselves, which they still do like Gifts of the lotus alerts.

 

That being said they probably shouldn't have a limit on the night wave lvls.  I think when they were originally putting in those lvl limits they were not planning on people to go that far out.  Nightwaves were originally planned for 10-12 weeks and that just didn't work out.

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6 minutes ago, Eluminary said:

With the credits you get from nightwave to 90 ranks you will have gotten more stuff there than you would have gotten in the alert system if you played 24-7 for a year .

Just have to say, in my case, this was demonstrably false. I got at LEAST 3 times more stuff from alerts, plus tons of resources and things Nightwave doesn't give that Alerts did. (and I was working 2 jobs for that year) Nightwave is a mega-downgrade in the amount of rewards you get out of it, while it's a MASSIVE increase in required "things you have to do" to earn those lesser rewards. Alerts were a superior source of stuff, and is likely why they yanked them and put the Nightwave thing in, IMO.

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I love how people always bring up how bad the Alert system was whenever other people complain about the NW system as if it somehow excuses it. "Oh hey, you don't like this new S#&$ty system? Well you are incredibly lucky you didn't experience this more S#&$ter system and you should be satisfied with what you have now instead of hoping for better stuff. It could be a lot worse you know." 

Just to clarify, I do think the NW system is an improvement over the alert system but it definitely has it's share of problems, mainly the slow rotation and bad NW credit economy for new players.

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Nightwave is better than alerts, and I enjoy it, but it's not without flaws, mainly it being a time-consuming project for DE that impedes development progress elsewhere, and we always end up with he seasons being way longer than planned due to delays: which is fine until you are sitting at max prestige rank, unable to get more credits while still putting up with the glass enemies. some improvements I think we need:

- better overall planning: try to set out a timeframe for the season, and if people don't like it, that's on them: you get told how long you have to experience the Nightwave, it's up to you whether you do so or not. try to plan it around roughly how long it would take to develop new assets from scratch.

- add an "endless" Nightwave mission that rewards small amounts of Nightwave Credits, regardless of current rank. that way when people have nothing better to do or reach the rank cap, they can still work towards some rewards if they so choose. in the case of Glassmaker, It would be a survival where all the enemies are glassed, but with each season, the theme of the endless mission would change to be appropriate for the season.

- perhaps try to develop a season where everything is developed from beginning to end, and instead of having to wait, players can just progress through the episodes like a quest: you reach a certain point and it takes you from episode 1 to episode 2, and so on. some might argue this would result in burnout, but at least then those who dislike Nightwave have the option to just "get it out of the way" without having to endure the season for months on end.

- add a "Tune Out" option that disables Nightwave dialogue and special enemeis once you hit the rank cap: then you don't have to listen to Nora or deal with the Nightwave enemies if you don't want to. I'm fine with Nora but I would turn off the glass enemies. I say only make it available after hitting max rank so that players always have the opportunity to get more credits, but then once you no longer need them, you can be left in peace.

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13 hours ago, (PS4)guzmantt1977 said:

Before NW we pretty much had to buy those potatoes with plat.

That wasn't my experience at all, I've never bought potatoes. Maybe 7pm - 10pm EST were magic hours for free stuff, but between alerts, gift of the lotus, and invasions I stockpiled lots of potato bps. Still have like 60 of each type left. Getting built ones from NW is nice (they are built right?), but potatoes are easy to build. I don't even have a smart phone so I certainly wasn't getting up in the middle of the night to run an alert.

So alerts were in fact good to some people. I do appreciate that alerts now allow me to spend my NW credits on the new offerings since I don't need potatoes, nitain, auras (used to give these to new players), or the old alt helmets. It also means I can completely ignore NW after 30 and can get there with minimal engagement since I don't need credits; just wish the glassed enemies would stop showing up in every bounty...

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2 minutes ago, (PS4)Elvenbane said:

That wasn't my experience at all, I've never bought potatoes. Maybe 7pm - 10pm EST were magic hours for free stuff, but between alerts, gift of the lotus, and invasions I stockpiled lots of potato bps. Still have like 60 of each type left. Getting built ones from NW is nice (they are built right?), but potatoes are easy to build. I don't even have a smart phone so I certainly wasn't getting up in the middle of the night to run an alert.

So alerts were in fact good to some people. I do appreciate that alerts now allow me to spend my NW credits on the new offerings since I don't need potatoes, nitain, auras (used to give these to new players), or the old alt helmets. It also means I can completely ignore NW after 30 and can get there with minimal engagement since I don't need credits; just wish the glassed enemies would stop showing up in every bounty...

I'm really glad for you, but I'll point out that not everyone is in the same timezones and has free time at the same moments or is lucky enough to catch those alerts. With nightwave, we all are able to log in once or twice a week on our schedule and get it all done, and we're all rewarded according to the effort we put in. And as you pointed out we get a choice of what rewards we want to take. I figure that is all good. 

I can handle the glassed, they're barely qualifying as a nuisance most of the time, and die pretty quickly anyway. I suppose if I was doing more "gotta stay undetected the entire time spy missions" or something I'd feel differently. 

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5 hours ago, (XB1)Kuhl MC said:

I actually don't mind getting all the potatoes I need for free now + some additional Kuva from time to time as well, just saying...

The potatoes aren't "free". Every one that you purchase with NW credits is costing you somewhere in the range of 100-220p.

Edited by sly_squash
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6 hours ago, Kefirno said:

So, repeated phrases are the issue?

I now know why I want to kill people who work at Telemarketing. They just repeat so many phrases like: "Good Morning/evening/night", "how can I help?", We thank you for the preference, have a nice day".

Who else wants to go to their homes and kill them in their sleep so they stop talking?

Also:

*deploys Clem Specter in Nightmare Mission*

CLEM!

*shoots the specter dead*

Repeats process x10

The wrost repeater of lines in this game. Kill it...

Edited by Kaotyke
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Hey at least it isn't WOSS.

They've come a fair way...though they always are a bit slow in getting that final chapter out, current events or no.

I also like the concept of a mystery...though the issue of "memorize this stuff and jump on platforms" is kind of a dissapointment, Phoenix Wright this ain't.

I'd imagine that some of the holdup is whatever boss or whatnot is going to be the finale.

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